What Would Really Be Great To Have on Merchants Row...

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Originally Posted by Danny

Technically not true! People still shop in malls, big boxes and mom and pop retails. Most downtowns in most American cities are not dying. People want to keep shopping traditional. It's good exercise, keeping up with your health and learning the value of the dollar. People shop more outside instead of the internet. It's to keep us from being slothful.

One day Gilberttown Detroit will come back to life where people live, work and play all around.

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I have to agree with you Danny. Even if to try an item of clothing they will later buy on the internet, folks will visit a store to make sure their purchase is a good fit. I find the internet good for a lot of things, and so-so for others. It may be that in time we will have biodimensional scanners to get a true fit dispatched to an electronic seamstress or tailor but we are still short of that. What is the use of buying clothes from a computer screen if the experience of going out is nixed in the first place. Fuggit.

Personally, I like to walk a busy commercial street even though I won't patronize a tiny fraction of the businesses on it. In the end, it's about experiencing life in the city or town, and communing with other humans in a haphazard fashion.

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Originally Posted by erikd

With every year that goes by, I purchase more and more and more of these type of goods online. Even now, I can't even imagine a scenario where I would buy something like a computer in a store. I have purchased my last 3 computers, 2 TVs, pair of speakers, microwave, 6 pairs of shoes, 3 cellphones, and dozens of other similar type goods, all online. I still go to brick and mortar stores for clothing and other goods that I want to touch or try out, but that isn't necessary for many basic, standardized consumer goods.

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Not sure if you're a millennial or not but even though I am I'm not sure I could buy any of those things on-line. Perhaps this has less do with age and more with the type of personalities but I need to see, touch, and try before I buy anything.

I was at a store this past weekend where their on-line purchases were final sale. I couldn't fathom buying something that way.

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Originally Posted by erikd

The entire retail industry is changing dramatically and rapidly. Many of the products that we have traditionally bought at brick and mortar stores are increasingly purchased online and home delivered. The selection, price, and convenience of online shopping is simply transformative, especially for standardized goods like consumer electronics and appliances.

With every year that goes by, I purchase more and more and more of these type of goods online. Even now, I can't even imagine a scenario where I would buy something like a computer in a store. I have purchased my last 3 computers, 2 TVs, pair of speakers, microwave, 6 pairs of shoes, 3 cellphones, and dozens of other similar type goods, all online. I still go to brick and mortar stores for clothing and other goods that I want to touch or try out, but that isn't necessary for many basic, standardized consumer goods.

While many people still buy these things from brick and mortar stores, that number is shrinking rapidly every year.

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Did you do that to avoid paying taxes?

Tax free internet purchases is another hurdle downtown stores will face on top of paid parking and farther from most residential areas in a region.

I can't believe anyone would buy shoes online. Then again, I have a hard to fit size.

Many of the online clothing stores have free shipping, and free return shipping, so if something doesn't fit you can send it back and try the different size until it does. It's not as good as being at a store and trying things on, but if you have an idea of how certain brands tend to fit you can get a lot of things online. Especially if you're looking for unusual fits or sizes that aren't usually in stock, you'll have better luck online.

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Originally Posted by downtownguy

Cleaners? Seriously? The last thing I want to do is to have to find a parking spot on Woodward to be near a cleaners, or, park a few blocks away and lug my dirty laundry to the store. Not to mention the business would be paying premium rents on Woodward when they could be more accessible to their customers off the main drag where the rent would be more affordable.

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Not to mention the fact that cleaners, if the plant is on site, generate a significant environmental hazard for future leasing.

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Originally Posted by dtowncitylover

Not sure if you're a millennial or not but even though I am I'm not sure I could buy any of those things on-line. Perhaps this has less do with age and more with the type of personalities but I need to see, touch, and try before I buy anything.

I was at a store this past weekend where their on-line purchases were final sale. I couldn't fathom buying something that way.

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I don't think that I have ever bought something on-line that was a non-refundable final sale. In my experience, the return policies of most online retailers is comparable to brick and mortar stores.

There are certainly a number of goods that I prefer to see, touch, and try before I buy, and for those things, I certainly go to traditional stores. However, there are a number of goods, especially computer/electronics and appliances, that you can't really try out at a store. I usually research these types of products online, read reviews, decide which options best suit my needs, and then search for the products that match what I am looking for.

If I want a computer, printer, TV, or any similar type of product made by many manufacturers, all featuring dozens of different options, it would take me an entire day of driving all over town just to check out what each store offers. Instead of spending hours driving to Best Buy, Sears, The Apple Store, Staples, MicroCenter, etc., I can spend 10 minutes checking their websites, and then just order the one I want.

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Originally Posted by downtownguy

Cleaners? Seriously? The last thing I want to do is to have to find a parking spot on Woodward to be near a cleaners, or, park a few blocks away and lug my dirty laundry to the store. Not to mention the business would be paying premium rents on Woodward when they could be more accessible to their customers off the main drag where the rent would be more affordable.

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Of course you wouldn't make a special trip downtown just to take your clothes to the cleaner. However, if you work or live downtown, it is convenient to have a cleaner that you can walk to. There has been a dry cleaner in the RenCen for decades that is largely supported by downtown office workers. Dropping off and picking up your clothes at lunch or on your way out of the office is a great way to go. No special trips needed. The same goes for downtown barber shops, tailors, banks, the post office, party stores, etc.

You have to remember that downtown has a huge population of daily workers who will patronize local businesses. The downtown customer base is much larger than just the residential population.

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Originally Posted by canuck

Personally, I like to walk a busy commercial street even though I won't patronize a tiny fraction of the businesses on it. In the end, it's about experiencing life in the city or town, and communing with other humans in a haphazard fashion.

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And if everybody thought that way, it wouldn't remain a busy commercial street. Ever gop to one of the "town developments" that isn't succeeding. It is full of people strolling around and the little shoppe owners are hanging out by their front doors hoping that someone will actually buy something.

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Originally Posted by Hermod

And if everybody thought that way, it wouldn't remain a busy commercial street. Ever gop to one of the "town developments" that isn't succeeding. It is full of people strolling around and the little shoppe owners are hanging out by their front doors hoping that someone will actually buy something.

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Yes, I know what you mean. It is one of the problems of operating a business, any business really from a home office or one with street frontage.

I didn't mean it that way though, I meant in the sense that one cannot possibly frequent all the businesses on a busy street. I for example won't shop at a skateboard shop unless my sons take me to one. I may try out a couple of Chinese restaurants on my nearby stretch of Ste Catherine street, and not hit a Cigar store because I don't smoke. I am just glad enough people do frequent these businesses so that the street remains active, but obviously; no one can be a patron to all retailers on said street.

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Originally Posted by canuck

Yes, I know what you mean. It is one of the problems of operating a business, any business really from a home office or one with street frontage.

I didn't mean it that way though, I meant in the sense that one cannot possibly frequent all the businesses on a busy street. I for example won't shop at a skateboard shop unless my sons take me to one. I may try out a couple of Chinese restaurants on my nearby stretch of Ste Catherine street, and not hit a Cigar store because I don't smoke. I am just glad enough people do frequent these businesses so that the street remains active, but obviously; no one can be a patron to all retailers on said street.

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They created a development called Waterside in downtown Norfolk, VA. When it opened, there was a large food court in the basement and the upper stories were pretty much filled with shoppes. I remember walking though there and you could see all of these women hanging out in front of their little shoppes hoping that someone would by something. They all looked like they had sunk their life savings into their little boutique in this supposedly exciting place. Now, twenty years later, Waterside is a success, but the food court is gone, the shoppes are gone, and the building is filled up with large nightclubs and destination restaurants.

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Originally Posted by erikd

Of course you wouldn't make a special trip downtown just to take your clothes to the cleaner. However, if you work or live downtown, it is convenient to have a cleaner that you can walk to. There has been a dry cleaner in the RenCen for decades that is largely supported by downtown office workers. Dropping off and picking up your clothes at lunch or on your way out of the office is a great way to go. No special trips needed. The same goes for downtown barber shops, tailors, banks, the post office, party stores, etc.

You have to remember that downtown has a huge population of daily workers who will patronize local businesses. The downtown customer base is much larger than just the residential population.

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I wasn't referring to making a trip downtown. Of course, the people that work downtown are a good base for a cleaner's. My point was about locating on Woodward, paying premium rents to be there, and having less convenient parking. Years ago, my favorite cleaners was in the historic building behind what was then Trolley Plaza. There was plenty of on-street parking for anybody wishing to pick up or drop off quickly.

The Ren Cen can far better support a cleaners thanks to it's relative isolation.