Illitch to build another Parking Garage, this time at Park/Henry

I'd still love to know how the board members of the Detroit Downtown Development Authority [[DDA) are chosen. They play a major role in shaping the city. They're the ones who awarded the Ilitches $250M for their arena and are set to award them another $74M -- for things like an arena parking deck and an overpriced Little Caesars HQ in another neighborhood. And who gave this non-governmental "non-profit" the power to collect and distribute taxes? It looks like it was the Detroit Economic Growth Corporation [[DEGC), yet another non-governmental "non-profit". Ok, who selected them, and who gave them authority? While we're at it, same questions for the Michigan Strategic Fund [[MSF) and the Michigan Economic Development Corporation [[MEDC).

I've looked for these answers and haven't found them. But it sure looks like a shell game run by private vested interests. Citizens, not corporations, should determine what to tax and what to do with the tax revenue. Or at least our elected officials. Please identify the elected officials to blame.

hopefully they start working on the Eddystone soon... it's probably not going to look too good when the first Wings game at the new arena is broadcasted with a massive abandoned/crumbling building 30 feet away [[and also people from out of town might be surprised when they park their car behind the arena and most of the buildings are also abandoned..)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by det

hopefully they start working on the Eddystone soon... it's probably not going to look too good when the first Wings game at the new arena is broadcasted with a massive abandoned/crumbling building 30 feet away [[and also people from out of town might be surprised when they park their car behind the arena and most of the buildings are also abandoned..)

---

One would think that wouldn't you?

Unfortunately it seems all that really matters to the Ilitches is that people believe that they might do something about those properties some day and that's good enough. emu steve is living proof of that philosophy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ABetterDetroit

One would think that wouldn't you?

Unfortunately it seems all that really matters to the Ilitches is that people believe that they might do something about those properties some day and that's good enough. emu steve is living proof of that philosophy.

---

That is a legitimate issue how quickly can the Ilitches get work going on the Eddystone.

It would be nice if work begins say next summer so that the exterior appearance improves before Oct. 2017 [[let them do the interior work during winter).

That property should be a priority behind the LCA and the parking garages because of its location.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by emu steve

That is a legitimate issue how quickly can the Ilitches get work going on the Eddystone.

It would be nice if work begins say next summer so that the exterior appearance improves before Oct. 2017 [[let them do the interior work during winter).

That property should be a priority behind the LCA and the parking garages because of its location.

---

They could probably start oh, let's say, tomorrow if they wanted too.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast

They could probably start oh, let's say, tomorrow if they wanted too.

---

I don't see it happening until the LCA is substantially completed.

I'd guess work will begin around the time seats are installed in LCA.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by det

hopefully they start working on the Eddystone soon... it's probably not going to look too good when the first Wings game at the new arena is broadcasted with a massive abandoned/crumbling building 30 feet away [[and also people from out of town might be surprised when they park their car behind the arena and most of the buildings are also abandoned..)

---

I would hope that too. But, Olympia made a conscious choice to move into a "district" that they completely blighted. I see no reason why they should hold off on Eddystone reconstruction, unless they plan to pull the same move that they did with the Madison-Lenox Hotel.

I like to think of emu steve as Chris Ilitch, furiously typing away defending his family's awful development and preservation legacy.

"Without sports coliseums, our lives would be as shaky as a fiddler on the roof"...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

"Without sports coliseums, our lives would be as shaky as a fiddler on the roof"...

---

Without sports coliseums, we'd be as bored as the Romans 2000 years ago... :o

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast

They could probably start oh, let's say, tomorrow if they wanted too.

---

Sure. They should just ask Gilbert how he was able to develop the Hudson's site, build the Z garage, and rehab the Vinton building all at one time. Oh wait, all he's finished so far is the parking garage.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CrashDummy

Sure. They should just ask Gilbert how he was able to develop the Hudson's site, build the Z garage, and rehab the Vinton building all at one time. Oh wait, all he's finished so far is the parking garage.

---

How is that a valid comparison? The Vinton IS currently being worked on and he has started and finished countless other projects in that time period. You cherry picked examples to defend a guy who has sat on properties and done nothing for 30 years. Comparison between Gilbert and the Ilitch's are laughable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by southen

How is that a valid comparison? The Vinton IS currently being worked on and he has started and finished countless other projects in that time period. You cherry picked examples to defend a guy who has sat on properties and done nothing for 30 years. Comparison between Gilbert and the Ilitch's are laughable.

---

You are 100% right about the "Comparison between Gilbert and the Ilitch's are laughable."

Ilitch was in Detroit for the worst 30 years of Detroit when the city headed south, big time.

Didn't Gilbert swoop in around 2010 after Detroit [[and the U.S. economy) hit rock bottom, bought cheap and rode the 'rising tide.' [[in fairness, he helped create the rising tide in Detroit).

Where was Gilbert in 2005 [[for the Super Bowl)? 2000? 1995? 1990? 1985? etc.

The comparison between Ilitch and Gilbert:

One was running uphill into a stiff wind.

The other running downhill with a breeze at his back.

Most developers, etc. are looking like 'geniuses' today. Most projects are successes now. It hasn't always been that way in Detroit.

Gilbert has renovated dozens of buildings over the past eight years.

Ilitch has renovated dozens of parking lots over the past thirty years.

Gilbert has restored the architectural integrity and character to dozens of buildings.

Ilitch has systematically destroyed historic architecture around downtown.

Gilbert has promoted the city everywhere he goes.

Ilitch has been relatively silent about Detroit.

Gilbert has embraced an active street life, sponsoring countless events in and around downtown.

Ilitch has reminded everyone that 30 years ago he reno'ed the Fox.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CrashDummy

Sure. They should just ask Gilbert how he was able to develop the Hudson's site, build the Z garage, and rehab the Vinton building all at one time. Oh wait, all he's finished so far is the parking garage.

---

What?

I've lost track of the number of Woodward Ave. and Capitol Park buildings and facades Bedrock has meticulously re-done [[at a very high level, reminiscent of present-day SoHo), to say nothing of a stunning renovation of the First National Building and One Woodward. Belt Alley is completely Bedrock's creation and is a transformative space. A new apartment building is rising on Griswold near Capitol Park. And they've been busy putting a massive Brush Park infill project, which has already won design awards, into motion. So yeah, they've been taking it easy over at Bedrock...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by emu steve

Without sports coliseums, we'd be as bored as the Romans 2000 years ago... :o

---

And also as distracted from what's really important.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 1953

Gilbert has renovated dozens of buildings over the past eight years.

Ilitch has renovated dozens of parking lots over the past thirty years.

Gilbert has restored the architectural integrity and character to dozens of buildings.

Ilitch has systematically destroyed historic architecture around downtown.

Gilbert has promoted the city everywhere he goes.

Ilitch has been relatively silent about Detroit.

Gilbert has embraced an active street life, sponsoring countless events in and around downtown.

Ilitch has reminded everyone that 30 years ago he reno'ed the Fox.

---

Though he doesn't mention with taxpayer money, yet again.

Ummmmm.... Gilbert is 54 years old.... Mike Ilitch has kids older than him.

Gilbert was born in 1962, graduated college circa mid 1980s when he had nothing... and Ilitch was already a billionaire. Gilbert started Rock Financial with a few others in 1985.... and became a billionaire circa 2005 around the time he bought the Cleveland Cavaliers. Now he's Michigan's richest man.

Emu Steve.... whatever historical comparisons you are trying to make with Ilitch and Gilbert.... they're pointless..... :eek:

Ilitch bought buildings for pennies on the dollar, and then did nothing with them, besides either flatten them, or let them rot. Gilbert paid [[for Detroit) top dollar... and is restoring them.

Honestly, EMU Steve, you have made every single discussion about anything Ilitch unreadable.

I know you aren't as stupid as your arguments so please be honest about your real end game. Because you are truly ruining any hope of real dialogue about any of this while ignoring Ilitch's history of soooo many promises.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

And also as distracted from what's really important.

---

The next presidential debate? :confused:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 1953

Gilbert has renovated dozens of buildings over the past eight years.

Ilitch has renovated dozens of parking lots over the past thirty years.

Gilbert has restored the architectural integrity and character to dozens of buildings.

Ilitch has systematically destroyed historic architecture around downtown.

Gilbert has promoted the city everywhere he goes.

Ilitch has been relatively silent about Detroit.

Gilbert has embraced an active street life, sponsoring countless events in and around downtown.

Ilitch has reminded everyone that 30 years ago he reno'ed the Fox.

---

What had Gilbert done during the lean times?

Once again, Gilbert was running down hill. Doing great things under very favorable conditions.

Ilitch was doing whatever he did [[Fox, Comerica, etc.) was done under very distressed conditions and he did not run for the hills, I mean 'burbs.

What we are seeing, to be fair, is that Gilbert is doing great things under very favorable conditions and with those same favorable conditions Ilitches are doing [[present tense) some great things.

That, to me, is almost a perfect development experiment: Two mega rich men with interest in building within the downtown/midtown areas at the same time, with albeit slightly different foci.

Apparently when all is said and done, each will have seen about 2B of development occur through their efforts.

In all fairness about your comment about promoting the city. That's not fair. Mike Ilitch is an elderly man who does not attend a lot of public events including watching his Tigers. When I was Dan Gilbert's age I was still running marathons. I compare that, in my mind, to a man who I believe uses a walker wherever he goes. A healthy 54 year old man is still in the prime of his life.

The voice of the Ilitches is obviously Chris Ilitch and he has been very positive about Detroit and is one of the great forces in Detroit today.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mackinaw

What?

I've lost track of the number of Woodward Ave. and Capitol Park buildings and facades Bedrock has meticulously re-done [[at a very high level, reminiscent of present-day SoHo), to say nothing of a stunning renovation of the First National Building and One Woodward. Belt Alley is completely Bedrock's creation and is a transformative space. A new apartment building is rising on Griswold near Capitol Park. And they've been busy putting a massive Brush Park infill project, which has already won design awards, into motion. So yeah, they've been taking it easy over at Bedrock...

---

Agreed. He's done a fantastic job at renovating office buildings and creating public space, but there seems to be this myth that everything he does gets done with such great speed, and that's not entirely true. With large scale restorations and new construction, there are still many more plans than finished product. I have total confidence he will complete most if not all of them and have the same confidence in Ilitch at this point in time until I see otherwise.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CrashDummy

Agreed. He's done a fantastic job at renovating office buildings and creating public space, but there seems to be this myth that everything he does gets done with such great speed, and that's not entirely true. With large scale restorations and new construction, there are still many more plans than finished product. I have total confidence he will complete most if not all of them and have the same confidence in Ilitch at this point in time until I see otherwise.

---

Agree.

For the sake of Detroit [[and the posters on this thread), 2020 can't come soon enough.

By then hopefully BOTH Gilbert and Ilitch will have finished what they have committed to doing.

If Gilbert does the Hudson site and the Ilitches do two dozen or three dozen or four dozen projects, I'll be happy for both and happy for the city of Detroit and those who live in it and visit it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gistok

Ummmmm.... Gilbert is 54 years old.... Mike Ilitch has kids older than him.

Gilbert was born in 1962, graduated college circa mid 1980s when he had nothing... and Ilitch was already a billionaire. Gilbert started Rock Financial with a few others in 1985.... and became a billionaire circa 2005 around the time he bought the Cleveland Cavaliers. Now he's Michigan's richest man.

Emu Steve.... whatever historical comparisons you are trying to make with Ilitch and Gilbert.... they're pointless..... :eek:

Ilitch bought buildings for pennies on the dollar, and then did nothing with them, besides either flatten them, or let them rot. Gilbert paid [[for Detroit) top dollar... and is restoring them.

---

FYI, Gilbert's net worth in 2005 was $900 million, Ilitch's was $815 million. Both dropped off the Forbes 400 list for a period, with Ilitch returning in 2006, Gilbert in 2011. Currently, Ilitch is #2 in Michigan at $5.8 billion, Gilbert is #4 at $4.6 billion.

I'm not applying any relevancy to this, just adding information.

EMU Steve - I have worked downtown for 13 years and followed its ups and downs closely. To say that Gilbert is running downhill is a misnomer. He created the f--ing hill. Without Gilbert's investment, I'd still be walking by a baseball stadium that is dead any time the Tigers are not playing. Instead, I walk through a bustling downtown every day that is full of Quicken/Rock employees and the employees of companies that those companies lured downtown. Your assertion that Ilitch's work was more valuable is totally laughable. In fact, I would assert that everything he has done could be lived without. The Fox, Comerica, the hockey Arena, etc. If he didn't come to downtown, the public sector would have a lot more money, and large sections of downtown wouldn't have been bulldozed. Gilbert would still have come because he has vision and he would have just had more buildings that he could restore and fill. Mr. I is not a bad guy, I don't think, but your insane support for his strategy over Gilbert's makes me want to say nasty things about him. You are really talking out of turn and I wish you would please stop.