How Equal Are The Changes In Detroit?

This has been all over my Facebook feed for the last few weeks, and I am interested to hear what this forum has to say about it.

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Detroit’s revitalization is made up of a majority of white people. That isn’t to say that Detroit’s black population isn’t contributing anything to revitalization, rather it suggests that there is a deliberate racially unequal distribution of support and funding. In total 818 individuals were identified from fellowship programs, business incubators, universities, foundations, and other “innovation” programs.

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Across all of the programs 69.2% of individuals were classified as White and only 23.7% as Black [[1.6% Latino, 4.8% Asian, 0.7% Arab). Looking at this new data, it is clear that there is a serious imbalance of both opportunity and outcomes in Detroit.

Detroit’s revitalization is completely one-sided. The surge in investment in this majority black city is not going to black residents. I began noticing a troubling trend. First, at Whole Foods one out of the ten featured suppliers were black. Then again when the 2013 Detroit Design Festival interviewed designers and one out of eight were black. A recent United Way campaign featured eight Detroit leaders and only two were black. I could only wonder why these revitalization efforts were so lopsided. Finally, I couldn’t help but cringe at TEDxDetroit 2013 where 80% of attendees were white coming up with “solutions” for Detroit, an 83% black city. To top it off, Wayne State University’s student population doesn’t even reflect the city with almost 50% white students and 20% black with only 9% of black students graduating in 4 years.

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http://alexbhill.org/2014/10/16/detr...ite-solutions/

To put these numbers into context, here are the 2010 Census results for Metro Detroit as a whole, and the City of Detroit proper:

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Within Metro Detroit, the census of 2010 reported 70.1% White, 22.8% African American, 0.3% Native American, 3.3% Asian, 0.02% Pacific Islander, 1.2% from other races, and 2.2% from two or more races. Hispanic or Latino of any race were 6.2% of the population. Arab Americans were at least 4.7% of the region's population [[considered white in the U.S. Census). The region's foreign-born population sat at 8.6%.

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As of the 2010 Census, the racial composition of the city of Detroit was:

• 82.7% Black or African American;
• 10.6% White [[7.8% non-Hispanic whites, 2.8% Hispanic whites);
• 3% from other races;
• 1.1% Asian;
• 2.2% from two or more races;
• 0.4% American Indian;
• 0.02% Pacific Islander.

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Metropolitan Detroit has been extremely segregated for decades, with a vast majority black population in the city proper, and a vast majority white population in the suburbs. The flight of businesses and residents out of the city and into the suburbs has resulted in devastating financial problems for Detroit city government, and has reinforced the socio-economic and racial divide by adding a geo-political divide on top of it.

In recent years, this trend has started to change due to a significant increase in the black population in the suburbs, and also the still relatively small, but increasing white population in the city, specifically in the greater downtown area.

There are a number of conflicting viewpoints and opinions about these changes, and I'm interested to hear what the Dyes people think...

Here how it goes:

Detroit remains mostly black while whites is the minority.

The most of the suburbs are mostly white while blacks are the minority.

The same goes with the regional businesses in both Detroit and suburbs.

The Metro-Detroit still remains in this 'urban donut' phase. But I do see a few changes going on in other communities.

Detroit is getting more regional businesses from the suburbs and other nations. Hip cool skinny jean millennials are moving in [[mostly from Gilberttown to Midtown) Detroit and middle class black folks are still moving away to the suburbs. That leaves the poor folks stuck their post troglodyte phase. But it least in the few years 'urban donut' culture in this Great State of 'Mich-ississippi' is going to change, in reverse.

You all can thank Gov. Snyder, the geek for that.

I think in order to get a complete picture one would have to interview the multitude of black millionaires and billionaires across the country,some would make Mr. Gilbert look like a corner newspaper salesman,and ask where they have been the last forty years,and their thoughts of investment in Detroit.

It would also be interesting to know at the point of disinvestment how many business owners that left were also African American.In the past there were also groups that made millions off of thier fellow citizens while destroying what was left,what was their investment in the city?

Every major city in this country went through the exact same thing to some degree but have rebounded,maybe a study of who and what played the roles in their case,if it is that upsetting maybe those investing should stop for awhile and see how it goes.

The changes are unequal. We are not radical enough for anything else to happen.

While the redevelopment taking place here is new and exciting in a Detroit context, it is only happening in ways that are very typical for America today. Thus, to expect any outcome other than the American status quo is wishful thinking.

My current favorite definition of privilege is: "the ability to act on opportunities as they present themselves."

By this definition, we should not be surprised that the people who capitalize on the opportunities available in Detroit today are going to look like people with privilege: mostly white, mostly male, mostly college educated, mostly with money.

As Detroit catches up with America in a big old hurry, it is unsurprising that it will catch up in all ways. This thread was started in response to our well-refined methods for justifying the status quo, namely:

1: The people with privilege will rationalize away their advantage, telling those with less privilege -- meaning less access to opportunities -- to "Stop identifying yourself as a subset of society and become a part of the solution instead of the problem."

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2: The people who succeed in spite of their relative lack of privilege will be highlighted to demonstrate that the system is only 90% rigged, so it's all okay.

No official or unofficial laws preventing anyone of any race or nationality from moving downtown. All it takes is the desire to do so and a little bit of $$$. I was watching the news, I dont remember exactly what the story was about but there was a guy on there saying they are doing all those things downtown and they should be doing things in the neighborhoods too. It gave me pause for a couple reasons. First of all who is this "they" he was referring to? who is doing what? and what should "they" be doing in neighborhood Detroit that isnt being done? Gilbert is moving jobs downtown but mostly these are jobs that require a degree. People with some $$$ are moving downtown and businesses are opening because these people need and want stuff. Did he want the hockey stadium to be off Van Dyke instead? Its easy to talk and complain but it takes work to position yourself to succeed. Its an unfortunate and sad reality that there just arent enough manufacturing jobs around anymore. Was the "they" he referred to white people? If so im not sure he thought thru his statement. If a few wealthy white people started moving jobs to his neighborhood and young white people started moving in would he really be happy? Probably be worried about getting priced out and complaining about gentrification instead. It seems like the city is are getting rid of dangerous empty structures or at least have plans to do so, putting more police on the street.
FWIW my area is far from segregated. It closely reflects the metro detroit population distribution stats you put up there.

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Originally Posted by gvidas

1: The people with privilege will rationalize away their advantage, telling those with less privilege -- meaning less access to opportunities -- to "Stop identifying yourself as a subset of society and become a part of the solution instead of the problem."

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I fall into the white male college educated category and feeling far from privileged. Put myself thru school, got some loans and grants, worked poverty jobs. Put myself back in and thru school and later graduate school where im just finishing up. I ride the bus and take care of an only guy with dementia who is entirely dependent on me for everything.
If this is the definition of privilege that i feel REAL bad for the underprivileged. Although, the underprivileged still get some help whereby Ive been completely self reliant. I would love a damn bridge card. Ive mastered the art of preparing dinner on less than $2

One way of looking at this is to say that Mr. Hill is basically making the case that the revitalization of Detroit is actually following the demographics of the region as a whole. Don't we want to view the metro area more that way and not as an "us v. them" approach?

Within Metro Detroit, the census of 2010 reported 70.1% White, 22.8% African American, 0.3% Native American, 3.3% Asian, 0.02% Pacific Islander, 1.2% from other races, and 2.2% from two or more races.Hispanic or Latino of any race were 6.2% of the population. Arab Americans were at least 4.7% of the region's population [[considered white in the U.S. Census). The region's foreign-born population sat at 8.6%.

We do everyone a disservice by this 'equality of outcome' discussion. Detroit's renaissance will be good for everyone. I applaud those who work to help those in need, but to put this ahead of helping everyone by a general renaissance is misplaced.

How equal are the changes? This is a really interesting question but it relies on an assumption that I still can't get past. I spend time in multiple neighborhoods primarily on the east side almost every day of the week and the neighborhoods I see are struggling to say the least. Then there's the issue of downtown...I had the day off on Friday and walked or drove all of the standard areas of downtown and midtown from noon to 8 and on this particular occassion it might as well have been 2005 because there was no significant increase in foot traffic and no particular buzz to speak of. I parked my car wherever I wanted on the street with little competition for spots near Campus Martius, Greektown and The Town Pump. After reading the news and other various websites I find myself prepping for some vibrant downtown that I still only encounter during special events or perfectly beautiful sunny days. I've worked and lived downtown previously and have experienced a few days over the years that have wowed me including Super Bowl week and a few other special events recently but I still don't see an overwhelming and consistent change downtown....just being honest. Maybe I expect too much after reading the hype.

The hype weather real or not is needed to counter act on all the negative feelings about the city and show others that there are also good people in the city.

Anyone who thinks there aren't good people in the city is, quite frankly, a moron and I personally find the hype to be a turn off.

More so then hearing everyday how bad the city is?Look through the eyes of somebody out of state looking to relocate and see how the city is viewed.

Maybe your looking at the perceived changes from the wrong angle. It seems the Detroit situation based on the numbers supplied is pretty lopsided now and any changes are a step towards equalization.

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Originally Posted by TTime

How equal are the changes? This is a really interesting question but it relies on an assumption that I still can't get past. I spend time in multiple neighborhoods primarily on the east side almost every day of the week and the neighborhoods I see are struggling to say the least. Then there's the issue of downtown...I had the day off on Friday and walked or drove all of the standard areas of downtown and midtown from noon to 8 and on this particular occassion it might as well have been 2005 because there was no significant increase in foot traffic and no particular buzz to speak of.

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Absolutely the neighborhoods are struggling as bad as ever and more tools to help fix them need to be constructed well beyond what already exist.

Any comparison to midtown/downtown circa 2005 to 2014 that claims that there is no difference seems so implausible that makes me question the motive. Do you want to help the neighborhoods to get better tools to improve by having a center core the is economically on the rise or do you want the city to be a complete and total failure to attract maximum attention that way?

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Originally Posted by ABetterDetroit

Absolutely the neighborhoods are struggling as bad as ever and more tools to help fix them need to be constructed well beyond what already exist.

Any comparison to midtown/downtown circa 2005 to 2014 that claims that there is no difference seems so implausible that makes me question the motive. Do you want to help the neighborhoods to get better tools to improve by having a center core the is economically on the rise or do you want the city to be a complete and total failure to attract maximum attention that way?

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I have experienced days when you can absolutely feel a difference, that is limited to a couple very specific locations, and I have also experienced days when it seems like there has been little or no progress. As I said there is a lack of consistency.

I do feel it's unequal but it's unequal in select areas. My frustration with this conversation is that it revolves around a very small area in the city. I'm not a fan of gentrification but Detroit is an exception to traditional gentrification. I'm not saying the imbalance in Corktown, Downtown, and Midtown is ok. It's not. What I am saying is energy and effort is better spent in the neighborhoods [[and Highland Park). Why waste time on Midtown when no one is interested in Livernois/7 Mile, Greenfield/Grand River, Oakman/Tireman, Grand River/Lahser, etc. These areas are waiting, begging, and ripe to be developed in the way you feel they should be but you want to worry over Midtown and Downtown? It makes sense to work on areas similar to what I mentioned before the problems in Midtown and Downtown are there.

I don't care about race. This is a regional problem that needs regional solutions.

For those of you who are keeping count, don't forget that there's a lot of black leadership in the neighborhoods doing a lot of good.

Black people are part of the solution. White people are part of the solutions. Billions are part of the solution. Underwater, hardworking folks working two minimum wage jobs taking the bus, mowing their lawn every damn week are part of the solution. Kids going into DPS with the deck stacked against them that emerge on the other side with a high school diploma are part of the solution.

It takes more than just money and billionaires, and just as issues and poverty are colorblind, so are solutions.

Gilbert can't do it alone, and he's got 700,000 people that have more skin in the game than he does; they live there.

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Originally Posted by maverick1

Why waste time on Midtown when no one is interested in Livernois/7 Mile, Greenfield/Grand River, Oakman/Tireman, Grand River/Lahser, etc. These areas are waiting, begging, and ripe to be developed in the way you feel they should be but you want to worry over Midtown and Downtown? It makes sense to work on areas similar to what I mentioned before the problems in Midtown and Downtown are there.

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West sider? Woodward, the great divide!

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Originally Posted by gvidas

The changes are unequal. We are not radical enough for anything else to happen.

While the redevelopment taking place here is new and exciting in a Detroit context, it is only happening in ways that are very typical for America today. Thus, to expect any outcome other than the American status quo is wishful thinking.

My current favorite definition of privilege is: "the ability to act on opportunities as they present themselves."

By this definition, we should not be surprised that the people who capitalize on the opportunities available in Detroit today are going to look like people with privilege: mostly white, mostly male, mostly college educated, mostly with money.

As Detroit catches up with America in a big old hurry, it is unsurprising that it will catch up in all ways. This thread was started in response to our well-refined methods for justifying the status quo, namely:

1: The people with privilege will rationalize away their advantage, telling those with less privilege -- meaning less access to opportunities -- to "Stop identifying yourself as a subset of society and become a part of the solution instead of the problem."

&

2: The people who succeed in spite of their relative lack of privilege will be highlighted to demonstrate that the system is only 90% rigged, so it's all okay.

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Agreed. While I understand the resentment city residents feel, for all of the above reasons and more, there is no reason to be surprised that the major investment in the city and media coverage of it is white.

Here's a really good response to this thread. It's not about equality. It's about recognizing the same opportunities are there. You can either choose to be a victim and lament how you're not being involved or you can get involved and create that change.

The whole us. vs. them debates. Old Detroit vs. New Detroit will never slow down or deter the "new" Detroit. It will just make the Old Detroiters jaded and bitter. Ain't no one got time for that.

http://www.dailydetroit.com/2014/11/...-get-involved/

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Originally Posted by maverick1

I do feel it's unequal but it's unequal in select areas. My frustration with this conversation is that it revolves around a very small area in the city. I'm not a fan of gentrification but Detroit is an exception to traditional gentrification. I'm not saying the imbalance in Corktown, Downtown, and Midtown is ok. It's not. What I am saying is energy and effort is better spent in the neighborhoods [[and Highland Park). Why waste time on Midtown when no one is interested in Livernois/7 Mile, Greenfield/Grand River, Oakman/Tireman, Grand River/Lahser, etc. These areas are waiting, begging, and ripe to be developed in the way you feel they should be but you want to worry over Midtown and Downtown? It makes sense to work on areas similar to what I mentioned before the problems in Midtown and Downtown are there.

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What does gentrification mean to you? To me, it means that a neighborhood's level of wealth has increased? Are you opposed to increased standards of living? Is that not a good goal? If the goal must be racially balanced, should we seek a balance that represents the City of Detroit [[80/20?) or should we seek the metro area balance [[25/75?). Which is more just?

Stop buying into the hype and focus on getting Detroit out of debt and back on its feet.
I thoroughly believe the church media machine along with social media perpetuates hate.

Should Detroit begin anew as a city built out of stereotypes where it's all shops selling
fried chicken, bbq, watermelon and malt liquor -- Hell No.
It is and will always be a multi ethnic, multi racial, multi skin color, mixed city.
Maybe 2015 could be the year where folks stop looking at skin color,
and look into the integrity and ethics of those attempting to renovate the city.

If some really, really, really want scummy surrounding, with tall weeds, rats, prostitution,
drug smuggling, burned out homes, gang artwork, broken glass in the street, with bums sleeping in the woods, and scrappers tearing stuff apart, etc., etc. then let them stay on that block and choke on it all - because they simply won't accept help without first checking to see which skin color is extending an olive branch of green money. Some folks just can't be helped.