Who recalls when he was down on Jefferson next to the Pontchetrain?
Article headline:
The battle to save Bert's: Beloved Detroit jazz bar headed to auction
http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/29...ded-to-auction
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Who recalls when he was down on Jefferson next to the Pontchetrain?
Article headline:
The battle to save Bert's: Beloved Detroit jazz bar headed to auction
http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/29...ded-to-auction
Hopefully he can raise enough money to cover whatever mess his son created. The story wasn't too detailed about what occurred with the son. Maybe Mildred Gaddis should have thought about that before she starting running down new people coming into Detroit starting businesses with the same sweat and hard work which Bert did. Seems to me like the son's mismanagement and how Bert's business is now at risk is unrelated to people coming to Detroit and starting their own businesses.
I remember, and have been to, the original Bert's, with the two huge coach lanterns out front. Yet another travesty. Yet another iconic Detroit landmark shut down by corporate greed and the greenies of Detroit. To quote Django "fuck midtown".Quote:
Originally Posted by Zacha341
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
The only travesty here is that his son apparently stole from the family business. Has nothing to do with midtown and other people working hard to be successful in the city.
B\S, Ever, since Eastern Mark-Up became privatized, Bert's has been squeezed by the City. Street license weren't renewed, violations keep getting piled on, making it harder to keep his doors open. Yeah, his son screwed up but corporate vultures were already circling. He too didn't fit in to the" New Detroit" curriculum. Maybe he'll be replaced by a cookie- cutter "Jazzcat Social Bowl".
I was at his establishment [[by the son) a few years back when visiting the city and I could see as a customer it was mismanaged. We had to run the waitress down to pay our bill, but we could have easily have gotten up and left and she / they wouldn't know.Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
We gave her a tip and she didn't know what it was? LOL, that shows the type of people working at his place.
I imagine there was a lot of theft by his employees too.
Hah! Eh, I'm not an old man and I live in the D. And I've been going to Bert's when I can and getting his great BBQ treats as recent as last week. I hope he makes it, they are open during the week for eat in or carry out. It just may be too late for him to turn it around. Sad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YounginDetroit
I follow some of the foodie websites including YELP they have been getting a lot of awful reviews for a while now go to http://www.yelp.com/biz/berts-marketplace-detroit-2 and sort the reviews by date and go to the bottom of the reviews and click on 16 other reviews that are not currently recommended
those are ones that have been removed maybe Berts did it self in by bad service and sub par food
^^^ Yeah, I found the service a bit off. The cashier during the week and I talked and I could tell moral was a bit low. She encourage me to return. I left a tip.
It's a tough business, very! And he's doing a bar, club and restaurant and the space sq. footage is vast.
If Burt's is to make it he'll have to do a complete turn about. He probably has some folks he could let go if that is impacting service. But the food was great!
My complaint is the lack of security of that parking lot for his night events! I know people who had their cars stolen and the late Marcus Belgrave had his trumpet stolen from his trunk during an event at Burt's.
Thankfully he got his horn back. Spend some money on security or some will not attend late night functions.
Yeah, I noticed stuff like that at Bert's but not just there. I had to all but bang on the employee/ kitchen door to get my check at HopCat in Midtown for an event on their roof.
Amazing the lack of enthusiasm of some wait staff!! Some folks would just eat and walk; it's imperative to manage the checks as well as service and quality.
Internal food shrink is legend if you are not managing a restaurant well. Out the back door goes your inventory cooked or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago48
There is a backstory here that includes Detroit's favorite deep pockets, and a clash of empires.
The location on Broadway was an item of dispute between Bert's son and Dan Gilbert. The way I heard the story, when the initial work for the Z-building was done...Gilbert's goons removed/disconnected the utilities from the Bert's on Broadway location. There was considerable pressure to sell the location to Bedrock or a derivative, including what seemed to be the illegal modification of a mortgage...which was solved by a briefcase of cash to finally chase off the evildoers.
So, I wouldn't go around saying Jai Lee stole from his father...but rather that cash was moved around their empire to solve a few crises. Around the same time, there was the move to GPP with Rockefellers, which must've taken some capital. I do not know any specifics, but am merely speculating to add to the dialog here. Nobody can doubt that he is able to get motivated employees able to deliver decent service there, hell every time I've been there, Jai Lee is hustling his butt off.
But I would not doubt that the opposition on Broadway to the Bedrock onslaught has triggered our local megalomaniac's backlash. He just might take pleasure in winning this auction, too...gain a foothold in another neighborhood, albeit through yet another scheme to take advantage of those down on their luck. He seems to be really, really good at that.
When I walked by Sunday morning, Bert was there...sweeping up his shop...even though the power was off for the whole area. He remains one of the hardest working people in Eastern Market, and does not deserve this bullshit.
Yikes, those reviews have got to sting. In the world of social media, and finger-tip review access you have to watch your standards and how you treat people. And you cannot ignore complaint.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddaydetroit
Honestly Zach341, Friends came in from Bloomfield for Friday Night Live! @ the DIA. When we came out @ 9:45, the wheels were gone off of their car. Woodard Ave., right in front of the DIA. What's up with that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Zacha341
All of it goes back to poor management.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zacha341
It can either be one, some or all of the below things:
*The owners are severely understaffing the establishment in order to maintain profitability and thus the waitstaff is stretched way too thin.
*The owners aren't paying their employees well enough to feel as though they should go above & beyond for the customers.
*The owners aren't properly training their employees on what should be good customer service when onboarding them.
*The owners don't have a functional corrective action policy in place for the downright awful employees that are still being paid by them.
Let's be accurate about your rant. The Eastern Market Corporation is private sector through a public-private partnership with the Eastern Market Corporation who's chief officer is from the City of Detroit Mayor's office and includes members from Focus Hope, food banks and local food businesses. Since this change in 2006, many physical improvements have been made and business at the Market has soared providing MORE OPPORTUNITY FOR EVERYONE. All businesses are required to operate under the laws of the City. No one has singled out Bert's to be run out of business. So get the facts straight and tell Mildred she should as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
I hope Bedrock reads this smear of yours about illegal mortgage modification and bribery.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gannon
If Gilbert/Bedrock is as big/important as many on here make them out to be, why would they give a fuck about what some "loon" [[no offense Gannon) says about them on the internet?Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitBoy
That's what Honky Tonk said in so few words, "privatized."Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitBoy
No. He made it sound like some big, greedy corporation has taken over the Market and is targeting businesses [[subtext BLACK owned businesses) to run them out. Then you have Mildred alluding to the same thing in this news clip. This constant tone of oppression is annoying. People should be thankful that there is growth in the city which was written off by just about everyone including many of the people who live in it.Quote:
Originally Posted by 313WX
k..........Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitBoy
Not all growth is good. Not everyone benefits equally from growth.
But every day businesses close despite being great. I don't think just being old and memorable should liberate anyone from basic economic realities.
On the other hand, citing 'basic economic realities' is a classic way to gloss over the unique challenges that black entrepreneurs face [[scroll down to the bit about the Rutgers/BYU/US study - one concrete example in a sea of challenges.)
Change is hard. Do you change at the same pace and in the same direction as the city changes around you? Do you wait for it to catch up? Or do you run around trying to stay one step ahead of the change?
Dangy, that's tight. It seems car issues are high midtown thru downtown, consistentl from what I see on crimemapping.com and have hear from people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
Excellent points, all... woe to the restaurant/ night club owner with even two of those things going on with their staff!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 313WX
Gvidas, you're right. Detroit should just do nothing and let crime, selling drugs and murder prosper because those appear to be better forms of growth and more equally distributed. Detroit doesn't need any new investment by individuals who expect to profit from taking the risk of coming here. Everything is fine like it is in the city. Why change anything?Quote:
Originally Posted by gvidas
Really? These are the only two solutions you can see? Crime and drug traffic running amuck or booting out old established residents and businesses, and erectring boutique shops and Chuck-E-Bars?Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitBoy
I don't really care for Eastern Market. Yeah Suppinos and the deli are great but overall the Eastern Market experience kind of blows. I would say maybe 15% of the stands are "Farmers" while the rest buy stuff from a wholesaler and resell. Its not a true farmers market. Where if I go to Royal Oak Farmers market, it's 100% farmers and nobody reselling packages of Strawberries that say "Westborn Market" on them. And the prices are better in Royal Oak too. I don't know how they can encourage more farmers to go down there and sell their stuff but at this point you are better off going to Meijers.
Cliffy, don't be a dummy. You're obviously not walking the entire market. And also, you need to consider what's in season and when you visited. When there is fresh farmer produce in royal oak, there will be many times more of the same in Eastern Market.
All good farmer's markets also act as fine food emporiums, so you will always have speciality food makers. Eastern Market has an incredible amount of these which makes it better than other urban marketplaces. This is in part a happy byproduct of the craft food movement taking off in Detroit. Further, there are stands that basically function as grocers, selling vegetables in the normal supply chain. Couple things: first, these are mostly wholesalers, so there are price benefits. Second, this is crucial during the offseason, which is the majority of the year in Michigan. It's perfectly great for a part of Eastern Market to function like a grocery store, particularly in a city/neighborhood that doesn't have enough. If you lived in LP or EM, would this not be a welcome thing?
Back on point: when you go to Meijers, you won't have the folks at Bert's supplying bbq ribs and music for your shopping interlude. That would suck. It would also suck if Bert's moved. I sure hope they don't. EM is so incredibly cool as it is right now and with everything it offers day and night. It does not, under any circumstances, need to be remade. More nearby housing on adjacent blocks would be wonderful, but honestly, it does NOT need to change. It's one of those few larger, multi-block areas of Detroit that we can actually say is top-notch compared withother cities.
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Well I am walking the whole market but the sad fact is that 85% of the people are people reselling stuff from wholesalers. Not farmers. Then you got people selling coffee, sweet potato pies, sausage, Amish looking cookie sellers, Zingerman's cheese... In terms of in-season vegetables and fruits if you got choices, Eastern Market is not that great. Maybe they priced out all the farmers and thats why they are in Royal Oak. I don't know. Royal Oak has no resellers though which is great and especially to someone like myself who is into Michigan stuff. When the Michigan tomatoes come out in a couple weeks... You will see how weak the selection is at Eastern Market compared to Royal Oak. Night and day.
Part of the issue could be those farmers are relunctant to come into Detroit. In fact, there are still quite a few folks who go out of their way to avoid doing anything in the city.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliffy
Throughout rural Michigan, the marginal improvements downtown notwithstanding, the city proper is still perceived as an off-limits hellhole.
Can you blame them with all the shootings, car jackings and hold ups going on and how mysteriously no one ever knows or sees anything when crimes like this occur?Quote:
Originally Posted by 313WX
People in Detroit dont see they are their own worst enemy by remaining silent.
k.........Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitBoy
What "facts" are you quoting me here? Some corporate mission statement? Hitler was making Germany better for EVERYONE, just ask the Poles and the Jews. I know both Bert and D'mongo. Both have invested time, money and stuck it out in Detroit when the going was tough and before it became "hip". Now that the moneymen want a piece of the action, there isn't anymore room for the independents. Remember when your Eastern Market Corporation ticketed and removed all the vendors from the overpass? Probably not. When Mildred drops by for cribbage tonight, I'll give her a glass of purple kool-aid and let her know she's upsetting you.Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitBoy
You're the one who sounds upset. There's 138 sq miles in the city. Seems like there is room for a couple of independent businesses but you seem to know more about business than everyone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by Honky Tonk
You know, your posts keep getting weirded. So now your saying forget about the client base you worked so hard to develop, forget the prime business location you have now, someone else wants it, so pack your stuff and move to a vacant field? You're right, I have no business sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitBoy
I realize you're just trolling. But I think underneath your hyperbolic nonsense is a point that is often made around here: "everything's so screwed up that any kind of progress is good."Quote:
Originally Posted by DetroitBoy
Here's two examples of what I meant by "not all growth is good":
1. Storing petcoke on the riverfront was, objectively speaking, "growth." Vacant land was put to use. But, in my opinion, it wasn't good growth. Tangible negatives for the neighborhood, and no jobs or local economic activity to offset the negatives.
2. Lots of other growth ends up being lot less good than it sounded at first. Remember the 175M tax break we gave Marathon for their refinery expansion? They sure grew with that one. But the bonanza of hiring definitely didn't happen. Maybe it's still a net gain for the city, maybe not.
These two examples are fairly superficial. There are many, many more if you start to delve into the kind of urban planning theory that is borderline blasphemous in SE Michigan -- heathen ideas like "more freeways mean more traffic" or "parking spaces out front are not as good for retail shops as bike lanes out front."
Part of the reason could be the cost of vendor space has risen since the Eastern Mark-Up Corporation privatization. It would be interesting to get some before and after data. It could also be that it simply isn'worth the time and trouble vs. profit.Quote:
Originally Posted by 313WX
What's the name of some of those RO farm sellers? I'd like to check them out when I am in the area as an option. Thanks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliffy
valid points... but before we get into the philosophical debates over gentrification.... the actual reporting of the story centers on how Bert failed to pay the mortgage and is now in the midst of a forfeiture proceeding. Being that, from the Fox report, it's a mortgage foreclosure, he's had well over a year to rectify the problem and/or redeem the property. The city isn't pushing them out, dan gilbert isn't pushing them out, Eastern Market isn't pushing them out... they haven't paid their bills for a while [[way longer than just a couple of missed mortgage payments). From anecdotal Yelp reviews posted above [[and those of posters), their service has been slipping for years. Couple that with Jai Lee's dumping cash and all the effort that goes into opening a new restaurant into the new-ish Rockafellers in GP.... I'm struggling to understand how this is an injustice that must be rectified and not just a series of bad business decisions or bad management leading to a restaurant failing.Quote:
Originally Posted by gvidas
Per Wayne County Register of Deeds -
Purchased in September 2003 for $760K with a $740 mortgage.
Sheriff's Deed in August of 2014 with a redemption price of $478K.
I've recently noticed that the majority of greenhouses/farmers actually come from quite a distance to sell their stuff at Eastern Market. Granted their are not a ton of Greenhouses in Troy, Auburn Hills or Novi but you see folks from Monroe, Columbus, Lenox, Richmond, Frenchtown - in fact the "Amish cookie folks" who are actually Mennonite come from Snover - which is all the way up by Port Huron in the Thumb. Think about it - who are they going to sell their cookies/pies to up there. You travel to where the money is and bring it back to your small town/rural area, increasing the wealth. Artists do the same thing - you live in TN, or Kentucky, or Corktown and sell your wares in Ann Arbor, Chicago, Atlanta, NY at art shows/fares and use that money to support your local home/community. Eastern Market is a third local [[i.e. Detroit urban farmers), wholesalers [[the lady who has to sell her fruit because she has a hot date), the popcorn guy from Downriver and the ex-urbann/rural farmers/nurseries.
As for Bert's - the only person who wins in this situation is the owner playing Bert. The more the media plays up the auction/Bert's/crowd-funding - all that money goes to the white owner. If Bert was smart, he wouldn't pony up a dime and would take his ribs elsewhere. The crowds will follow.
same reason most companies have a team that monitors social media...as the man said, a lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes. But yeah, one post? nah. however, I'd imagine if ole steve neavling, what with his perpetual hard on for all things Gilbert, picked up this accusation of Dan Gilbert participating in, or directing, a criminal conspiracy from this thread...but threw in a few "allegedly"s to cover his ass in the defamation suit, they'd definitely notice.Quote:
Originally Posted by 313WX
Actually, I think gannon and I have used enough key phrases... Gilbert, Dan Gilbert, Quicken Loans, criminal, conspiracy, thugs, goons, illegal modification, mortgage, Detroit to have already popped up on the report though. would be interesting to see if this thread continues....
Exactly. Maybe he's just been in the Market area for so long that it's hard to see the forest for the trees. But hae should keep in mind when he was pitched off of Jefferson too, for another set of gentrification efforts.Quote:
Originally Posted by belleislerunner
I agree with both Honky Tonk and Cliffy though, those pursuing the "modernization" efforts that [[Neo-)DetroitBoy touts so adamantly have resulted in an Eastern Market area that may seem more amenable to developers, suburbanites, and the too-small-hat-and-horn-rimmed-glasses crowd, but in the process is crowding and pricing out everything that was special, unique, and yes, authentic, about the place itself. Now it's soon to be just another malled environment of folks selling an overpriced "urban experience" to "adventurous" cool white people, complete with pricy neo-crunchy-vittles, second-hand marked-up veggies, not-so-special "specialty" stores, piles of knick-knacks, and junk.
If Eastern Market is too crowded and too upscale, reopen the Chene-Ferry Market. Last time I checked the sheds are still there.
Or better yet, just drop by the GP Farmers Market.....Quote:
Originally Posted by GPCharles
Looks like he's trying to save his precious jazz club by letting the Satanists put their statue of the God, Baphomet in their theatre hall.
Current bid is $1,610,000 [[+ 5% buyer's premium) but the reserve price has not been met.
Perhaps the devil is in the details on that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny
Sold for $1,985,000 + the 5% buyers premium. Reserve was met.
Wow. To who?
Retrospective correction. Once they found out what they were renting to, no one at Bert's was having any of that so they returned the rental deposit and told them to go someplace else.http://www.freep.com/story/news/loca...yers/30682409/Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny