I thought this might be a good topic for discussion. Personally I think it was wrong for her to say it but an apology was all that was necessary. Your thoughts?
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I thought this might be a good topic for discussion. Personally I think it was wrong for her to say it but an apology was all that was necessary. Your thoughts?
i'm not a big fan and she did tell the truth under oath. not sure if it was the whole truth but i think she may have been on the chopping block with the food network anyway.
Despite what she may or may not have said, I think they should smear her with bacon grease and put her on the first manned rocket mission to the sun.
My second choice is that they'd do a re-make of Forrest Gump giving her the lead role. The only exception would be in the last scene of the movie, she'd get confused, go looking for a few pounds of butter and get run over by the school bus. Just my personal opinion.
So is it the new thing that every celebrity loses their show if they make a racial slur? People needs to grow some balls, it's a fricking word. Now if she wasn't treating people of other races equally in her restaurants, then I'm ok with it.
I'm pretty sure it was more the context of "having n* dressed up in white shirts and black bow ties" serving at a "plantation themed" wedding reception.Quote:
Originally Posted by jerrytimes
It's so funny that those "bastions" of free enterprise are getting on a private company's case for firing someone
Could this possibly matter any less?
If in society there is no forgiveness how uncivil have we become? Just because she said something a long time ago, or felt a certain way back then doesn't mean she feels that way now. After all I used to consider myself a republican.
It's only okay for those of color to use the 'n' word. Which they do all the time.
Broad statement there. Not even on of color uses this word as you say. Nope... I don't.
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Originally Posted by Ray1936
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Originally Posted by Zacha341
I don't think Ray1936 was implying that ALL black people use the word, just that many do use it a lot. Heck, JayZ and Kanye West basically built their careers off the word, but I don't see the media ripping them apart for it. Paula Dean was recounting what she said after being held up at gun point nearly 30 years ago.
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Originally Posted by Johnnny5
Really? What I heard was her describing a proposed antebellum plantation theme for a wedding
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Originally Posted by rb336
Here's a link to a transcript of the deposition.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3467287.html
My only implications were that I think she was a knob that promoted horrible recipes and was exceptionally annoying. Just one more reason I cancelled my cable. Again, just my personal opinion. Maybe promoting diabetes and obesity should be showcased more.
First off, thanks to Zacha341 for pointing out that not every black person uses that term, as I most certainly don't as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray1936
Secondly, I'd like to ask Mr. Ray1936 if he has a nickname for his wife? If so, is it alright if I call her by his nickname for her? I certainly would never entertain the idea of calling another man's wife sweetie pie or snookums, or whatever other term a man has for his wife. When people share a bond and an understanding with each other, it's okay for them to call each other certain terms that might not be okay for others outside of that relationship to use.
Okay, okay, the rebuttal argument from most people would be that I'm comparing apples and oranges by comparing the most intimate of relationships [[a marriage) with people who might actually be strangers to each other and their only bond might be their ethnicity. That was an analogy I was using, so let me tie it up.
I work with a bunch of white people, some of whom like to refer to themselves as rednecks from time to time. They even argue over the true meaning of the term redneck. They say that a redneck was originally just a Michigan farmer who worked out in the sun all day and so his neck turned red. They even seem to show a little pride in calling themselves rednecks. Hey, whatever. My point is this, if they want to refer to each other as rednecks, that's their business. I never refer to any white person as a redneck. To me that would be rude and disrespectful and something I refuse to do, even if they call themselves that.
You know what I will call white people, though? I have a very, very special name for each and every white person that I call them by [[it's actually similar to the name I have for anyone of any ethnicity I deal with): THE NAME THEIR MOTHER GAVE THEM. That's the name I'd appreciate being referred to by as well, the name my mother gave me. I don't know why that's so hard for people, especially ones who claim they don't see skin color.
Also I think the Food Network saw the situation as a opportunity to throw her under the bus since her ratings had taken a major hit even before all of this came out. She lost 25% of her total viewership from last year and 32% in the 25-54 y/o demographic which is the demographic her show was aimed at. I bet the exec's at the Food Network are grinning from ear to ear. Paula gave them a reason to can her and the Network can look like the good guys in the processQuote:
Originally Posted by old guy
^^^ Points well taken... for the record I am not impressed with Jayz, West or other incarnations of that kind of music thrown up the pop chart and celebrated.
Overall I am pretty done with the racial slurs on all sides. I am not comfortable, or 'tee-hee' white people calling themselves red-necks, or hearing it used as a slur. And having worked/ volunteered to engage black youth I have challenged the use of the N-word use, whatever the context, where it comes up.
I got in a wee bit of trouble for using the word "niggardly" once, even though the word is completely unrelated to the n word. It is derived from the Old Norse nigla - which is to be overly concerned with small matters and it is related to the term niggling. The n-word has its roots in Portuguese/Spanish.
I think the whole notion of being so offended by words that people want to use the force and stigma of government or public opinion to make things right is immature. What kind of a weak-kneed society have we become? Now if this went to actions where someone was physically hurt this is another story. But these were words said years ago.
That sounds like a reasonable explanation. Companies should also be able to fire people for violating policies. If there is a policy condemning the use of disparaging names, that is probably already understood by most employees. Freedom of speech does not extend to company employees however. Quentin Tarantino use the n word multiple times in his movie. That was ok because he was not constrained by such understandings and because of the words' context. So it isn't so much the use of the word as its context. What gets puzzling is why someone like Jesse Jackson can get away with similar things he's said.Quote:
Originally Posted by firstandten
A lot depends on how valuable certain people or companies think you are. If the Food Network didn't think that Paula was near the end of her run, she would have gotten a slap on the hand. However her attitude plus her calorie busting, diabetes bomb dishes made her expendable to the people who care. Jesse on the other hand is pretty autonomous and because of it he can get away with some pretty outrageous statements as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by oladub
Getting rid of her probably saved a few people from heart attacks so her firing also has, probably inadvertently, a health component.
So if it happened to you, you'd be OK with it. Getting fired for something you said 30-40 years ago before you were working there.
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Originally Posted by SPIRITED
people forget that this all stems from a current lawsuit alleging a pattern of racial discrimination and harassment at her restaurant.
Decades back Hollywood actors, writers and others were black listed and were denyed work because of being suspected communist sympathizers. This was a dark time in our history called McCarthyism. This is history repeating itself.
Actually, you might want to study the McCarthy era, J. Edgar Hoover era a bit more before making a ridiculous statement like that.Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIRITED
It's a witch hunt just the same. Paula's use of a racial epitet decades ago is being used and costing her a career. Being a communist sympathizer n McCarthy's era cost people theirs.
um, there is nothing factually wrong in spirited's statementQuote:
Originally Posted by old guy
I don't understand why a comment she made long before her contracts were made and signed and was long forgotten should have caused her to lose her job. These were pre-existing conditions and were brought up only to create racial uproar. She doesn't act that way now, and has had a pretty clean persona to be in a position where all those contracts were created and her face and mouth put on national TV.
Based on this woman's situation, are we saying that anything anyone made at any point of their lives can be drug up years down the road to end someone's career if it is something that offends?
Where does this racism witch hunt end?
I don't see Jamie Foxx losing any contracts after saying on national TV that he enjoyed doing Django Unchained because he got to kill a bunch of white people...
http://youtu.be/mnCBNho9Kak
Difference - Jamie Foxx was doing satire. the relevant comparable to Foxx would be that classic Pryor/Chase bit.
http://youtu.be/Ocfm-6KAWGI
Sorry. I'm having a hard time equating the two situations. I understand where you see similarities, but isn't this merely a civil law suit filed by an employee.Quote:
Originally Posted by rb336
I think at the time this video was made, part of the joke was that no one thought a black man could ever become president. Little did they know!
Richard Pryor, 1st black President
Kanye West comments on Paula Deen:
'Paula Deen doesn't care about Black people!'
Using a racial slur isn't even the main issue. She was being sued and [[ended up getting fired) because the racist, sexist and homophobic environment at that restaurant.
Anyone that would be OK with that is obviously an awful person.
Really? I wasn't aware of that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray1936
What would have happened to Paula Dean if she called someone who was annoying or even harassing her a "cracker"?
Same thing, when as a celebrity you are a brand, you need to walk a lot of lines as to not to offend those that made you what you are. If you can't do that then maybe Paula should just stick to writing cookbooks and running her restaurants and fighting lawsuitsQuote:
Originally Posted by oladub
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Originally Posted by old guy
Not saying the two situations are the same, that is strictly a matter of opinion. I'm saying the comments were correct about McCarthyism. I can see the argument - anyone accused of being racist can lose their job because of it. but there is a bit more smoke to the Paula Dean situation, although I think it is more ignorance and insensitivity than malice
That just isn't true. Everyone who gets accused of harassment at work DOES NOT get fired. BUT, if you are a public figure, companies aren't going to keep them unless they are a big earner.Quote:
Originally Posted by rb336
And he by default does? ---:rolleyes:---
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Originally Posted by Danny
I guess I do see some similarities, but having read so much information about McCarthyism over the years, I just see it as a period in our history that was so dark that to compare it with this situation of a celebrity that hasn't actually been charged with anything other than a civil lawsuit yet, seems a bit over the top.
Back then, people were convicted of being communists and sent to prison. Even some of their attorneys were sent to prison for representing them. People were hauled before Senate sub committees without reasonable cause and their careers were ruined. To date P. Deens book sales have skyrocketed, and although many of her corporate sponsors have dropped her, her popularity is soaring. She has the means to fight all this in court and might even file countersuits.
I can't even believe I'm spending this much time talking about her.
Maybe I'm right, maybe I'm wrong. I just don't see the validity of comparing her case with McCarthyism, even though it's now used as a general term for numerous wrongdoings.
HA! The plot thickens. Now Jesse Jackson is getting involved. Will people know whose side to support through knee-jerk reactions? Will they have to "think" about what they believe.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...rthy-redempti/
I don't think people will have to think at all. Nothing changes, Paula is a bigot who views were made public and now its hurting her in the worst place of all...her pocketbook. Jesse is a civil rights mercenary who is trying to stay relevant. Its a perfect match. Paula calls on Jesse to stop the financial bleeding and in return Jesse gets a nice fee and soul food for life.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crumbled_pavement
Is the conservative-cause-du jour about defending the right to make racist comments or defending employers' rights to fire employees?
That's any easy one. Censorship is usually a liberal thing [[e.g. Army personnel are not allowed to read about NSA scandals as reported by the Guardian , hiding one's records by executive order, "fair speech" laws, shouting down conservative speakers at universities, etc.). Besides, the First Amendment guarantees freedom of speech no matter how offensive. That leaves the employers right to fire employees for what they say and do that violates their contract or damages the image of the company. For instance, pro sports players regularly lose their sponsorships and sometimes even their jobs when they get caught drugging themselves or killing someone.Quote:
Originally Posted by noise
When will Al Sharpton chime in? There is money and attention for whores like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton when it comes to racism. If those offended just took this at face value and accepted her apology this wouldn't be getting so much attention. And I'd go to the extreme that if any private business doesn't want a certain "type" of clientele in their establishment, being a private business I support their right. Although it might be a stupid one. Ultimately the ones to suffer the aftermath of these types of business decisions are the business owners.Quote:
Originally Posted by firstandten
An apology starts to ring hollow when a person has a history of bigoted behavior and history of bigoted statements. In Paula case people felt the apology was given only to stop the financial bleeding on her income statement. Like I said before when you become a "brand" like she is there is a price to pay apology or not when you start to offend people. She's paying that price now.Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIRITED
Rush Limbaugh can [[sort of) get away with his bigoted, anti-women, homophobic BS because that IS his brand. I included the "sort of" because his empire is being held afloat by money from various right-wing groups. Almost every major company has pulled their money from his showQuote:
Originally Posted by firstandten
Paula's statements were ignorant. Dropping her from Foodnetwork and others was done out of fear of backlash. Angry public opinion is just hatred. Forgiveness has gotten so rare these days.Quote:
Originally Posted by firstandten
that is a good pointQuote:
Originally Posted by SPIRITED
I don't have a problem with forgiveness, something said or done in the heat of the moment yes, one should forgive. However when someone exhibits a pattern of offensive behavior and only apologizes because the endorsements and money stop flowing. She can take my forgiveness and stick it where the sun don't shineQuote:
Originally Posted by SPIRITED
Just in case anyone wants to know what this is really about [[and it is NOT saying the "n" word 20 years ago), start at pg 14 of the complaint, item 51.
http://www.atlawblog.com/wp-content/...-Complaint.pdf
it is truly disgusting
Thanks for clarifying, I dont feel bad for her at all.
Thanks for the link, that was kind of an eye opener.Quote:
Originally Posted by rb336
Looks like Bubba Hiers was a real dirtbag.
Not defending anyone but at this point this is still just a complaint? No?Quote:
Originally Posted by rb336
no, it's a trialQuote:
Originally Posted by Wheels
Even if it's a trial, it's mostly, at this point a court of public opinion, which in some ways is similar to a referendum. Something that rarely exists anymore, and in the state I live in, non-existent. It might seem somewhat unfair, but let the people speak and draw your own conclusions. What happens in court is the final word, but for people to put it out on the table as to what they think, gives the people a voice. Used in moderation and without malice, I think it adds an additional dimension to the process.Quote:
Originally Posted by rb336
The word has a different meaning in my family history. We had no slaves so the color of a persons skin didn't draw that description, but seeing their actions did.
You should probably just delete this post.Quote:
Originally Posted by qsabe
That's about the strangest posts I've ever seen on this site. I had to read it a number of times just to understand it. You are a scary person. WTF.
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Originally Posted by old guy
I read some of his posts on other threads [[there aren't that many) he did say he was 77 years old. Maybe that had to do with some of it.