View Full Version : The Patriot Act Makes ME Feel Safer (cuz I'm a sheeple..)
DetroitDad
May-06-09, 08:59 PM
16 year old busted for alleged bomb threat, and stripped of due process under "Patriot Act"
http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/5049867
"Lundeby told the officers that someone had hacked into her son's IP address and was using it to make crank calls connected through the Internet, making it look like the calls had originated from her home when they did not.
Her argument was ignored, she said. Agents seized a computer, a cell phone, gaming console, routers, bank statements and school records, according to federal search warrants.
"There were no bomb-making materials, not even a blasting cap, not even a wire," Lundeby said.
Ashton now sits in a juvenile facility in South Bend, Ind. His mother has had little access to him since his arrest. She has gone to her state representatives as well as attorneys, seeking assistance, but, she said, there is nothing she can do.
Lundeby said the USA Patriot Act stripped her son of his due process rights."
DetroitDad
May-06-09, 09:06 PM
http://lewrockwell.com/grigg/grigg-w93.html
It's been said that a lie is a poor way to say "hello." It is also the standard greeting one receives from government employees, particularly those who carry guns.
Around 10:00 p.m. on March 5, a wolf-pack of armed men gathered at the front door of the Lundeby family's home in Oxford, North Carolina.
When she answered the doorbell, Annette was greeted with the sight of a State Highway Patrolman who introduced himself with a lie. Things went dramatically downhill from there.
"He told me that my son Ashton had committed a hit-and-run with somebody's car," Annette told Pro Libertate in a phone interview. "I said, 'No, that's not true – it was exactly the reverse; he was on the receiving end of a hit-and-run, and that was last January.'"
The State Trooper's lie was a pretext to rouse the home-schooled teenager from bed and bring him to the doorstep. Once the falsehood shattered against Mrs. Lundeby's polite resolve, however, the pretense was dropped and roughly a dozen armed men in body armor stormed into her home....
ccbatson
May-08-09, 12:23 AM
Those lies were designed to keep calm in a situation in which the agents in the field were under the impression that they were dealing with someone potentially dangerous. The purpose was to accomplish the mission with the least likelihood of violence and apprehend a suspect (rather than incite a potentially violent scene).
Those lies were designed to keep calm in a situation in which the agents in the field were under the impression that they were dealing with someone potentially dangerous. The purpose was to accomplish the mission with the least likelihood of violence and apprehend a suspect (rather than incite a potentially violent scene).
So you can manipulate someone into forfeiting their rights???
oladub
May-08-09, 08:52 AM
Wired Magazine reports that this kid actually was making bomb threats to schools.
Teenage Bomb Threat Suspect Was Internet Prank-Call Star (http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/05/teenage-bomb-threat-suspect-was-an-internet-prank-phone-call-star/)
ccbatson
May-09-09, 04:55 PM
He forfeited his rights by his actions...not by way of the enforcement of the appropriate laws governing those actions.
DetroitDad
May-09-09, 10:36 PM
What happened to innocent until proven guilty?
They need to treat him as innocent until they can prove that he did it without a reasonable doubt, in a court of law.
ccbatson
May-10-09, 03:16 PM
Innocent until proven guilty applies to formal charges, not detaining somebody for just cause.
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."
Benjamin Franklin
Innocent until proven guilty applies to formal charges, not detaining somebody for just cause.
You keep stepping in it, Batty.
So with your logic, Tush & Cheney could pick you up, render you to a foreign black-site prison and detain you for say...6 years with no charges, no access to an attorney, press, family, etc?
Well, that's what's been going on, and to AMERICAN CITIZENS, not only foreign fighters. The Bush Fascists had been picking up American citizens, normal, everyday people who were mistakenly accused of being "enemy combatants", and it was all a lie.
Only prison and bankruptcy will make the Tushies understand what it's like to be humbled. I hope the EU court system arrests all of them and imprisons them for life. Too bad our justice system is so politicized and scared shitless to do anything about it.
You and your repugnican fascist friends need to go establish your own nation and not shred our constitution for your own socially retarded, unamerican views.
Big Dog
May-10-09, 08:04 PM
Wow! That is some reply alright.
ghettopalmetto
May-10-09, 08:26 PM
Innocent until proven guilty applies to formal charges, not detaining somebody for just cause.
Are you aware of the concept known as "habeus corpus"???
CCBatty is like that little head that sticks up on the shoulder of someone who's bothered by conscience. The host stays dormant while the little head screams the mantra of the Repugnican Reich. :eek:
He's a perfect parrot to Yawn "the manatee" Hannity, Lush Bimbao, Shrill O'Reilly, Glenda Speck, Michael "Weener" Savage, Roger Hedgehog, Michael "cheezer stache" Medvedev, Mann Coultergeist, Big Dick "toe sucker" Morris, Bill "high roller" Bennett, etc, etc.
What does this rogue's gallery of general miscreants and social retards have in common?
They all liplock the teats of Rupert Murdoch- the slithering succubus of fascist tabloid tripe called Newscorp.
How's that for a little "truth in advertising," eh?
oladub
May-10-09, 10:47 PM
Lorax, Sen. Barack Obama voted YES on March 1, 2006, on reauthorizing the Patriot Act (Patriot Act II). That's ok?
Are you aware of the concept known as "habeus corpus"???
don't you remember? the republicans believe that just because the constitution says habeus corpus can't be suspended, it doesn't mean the right exists!
oladub
May-11-09, 08:47 AM
don't you remember? the republicans believe that just because the constitution says habeus corpus can't be suspended, it doesn't mean the right exists!
I pulled out my scorecard.
In the House-
Republicans foted 211-3 in favor of the Patriot Act
Democrats voted 145-62 in favor of the Patriot Act
In the Senate-
All Senators voted for the Patriot Act cxcept for Russell Feingold (D-WI).
Lorax, Sen. Barack Obama voted YES on March 1, 2006, on reauthorizing the Patriot Act (Patriot Act II). That's ok?
Yeah, and George Bush decreed the Mariannas Islands a protected wildlife refuge.
We all step out of character once in a while.
Obama happened to be wrong about that.
Republicans, including Cheney still refuse to throw Limbaugh under the bus. I guess being a racist, anti-semitic, bigoted, chauvinistic, mysiogonistic, homophobe- and drug addict isn't enough.
Perhaps Limbaugh needs to be found with a live boy, or a dead girl to get the message across.
Hell, running around his 40,000 sq. ft. mansion in Palm Beach in 18th century knee breeches and powdered wigs isn't enough, apparently. Yes, he's been known to pull a Giuliani every so often.
Perhaps Limbaugh needs to be found with a live boy, or a dead girl to get the message across.
He was busted with a viagra prescription with someone elses name on it while on a flight back from a resort infamous for child prostitution, so my guess is no, even that wouldn't do it
DetroitDad
May-11-09, 01:38 PM
Anything with a name like "Patriot Act" should have been viewed as someone trying to play emotions to further their agenda.
The funny thing about legislation and how it's named under the Repugnican Reich, and how developers name subdivisions is eerily similar.
What ever the legislation is called, is always the opposite of what the legislation does.
Patriot Act = spying on Americans
Clean Air Act = dirty air
Clean Coal Technology = pollution
No Child Left Behind = all children left behind
Subdivisions have the same bizarre names
Old Orchard = where an orchard used to be, now only houses
Babbling Brook = brook filled in for housing development
Rose Terrace = where the Dodge Mansion use to be, roses were also mowed under
etc. etc.
Detroitej72
May-11-09, 06:21 PM
He was busted with a viagra prescription with someone elses name on it while on a flight back from a resort infamous for child prostitution, so my guess is no, even that wouldn't do it
He did brag that he had a great time, but wouldn't tell anyone about it. That pretty much admits he was doing something that he wants kept quiet.
However, with his ditto heads, he could tack advantage of their wives, and they would claim she seduced him. The sheep will never leave his flock because they think of him as their dear leader.
Brush Lintball is the Caftan Warlord of the Repugnican Reich.
oladub
May-11-09, 08:15 PM
Lomax, "We all step out of character once in a while.
Obama happened to be wrong about that."
True enough but I don't think this is wildly out of character for Obama. After all he also voted twice to allow and then expand Bush's wiretapping and doesn't seem adverse to restrictions abridging free speech. On January 20, he signed an executive order designed to reduce the transparency of some of his personal records.
ccbatson
May-11-09, 09:30 PM
It is not out of character with a liberal fascist, or Marxist...think about it.
Detroitej72
May-11-09, 10:23 PM
It is not out of character with a liberal fascist, or Marxist...think about it.
Why did you choose to ignore neo-cons lack of character? Do you sympathies with them?
Liberal facist? You forgot monarchist. You must obey the newest directives from Mitt Romney.
BTW, there is no such thing as a liberal facist. There is no such thing as a liberal facist marxist. There is no such thing as a liberal facist socialist communist monarchist. Stringing these terms together make you look like you are immature and do not understand what any of these terms mean, and are therefore to be ignored.
You left out anarchist
Problem with the Republican Taliban is that they drink the KoolAid when listening to social retards like Sean Hannity, who conflate terms with regard to a person's political leanings.
I have this fight with the Republican Reich constantly when it comes to terms such as 'liberal' 'fascist' 'marxist' 'bolshevik', etc.
I will often use these words to correctly describe the social rantings of some of these sheeple, like CCBatty, because they really aren't educated enough to know the difference.
And it makes for great theatre!
George Tush and company were the closest thing to an oligarchy we've ever had in modern times. Their leanings were fascist in the truest sense of the word, since the definition of fascism is corporate and government interests co-mingling, with corporations having the upper hand.
Republicans have for years, and ratcheted up during Reagan's reign, said that government is the problem, and private enterprise is the solution to all society's ills. Obviously this is flawed thinking, look where we are now with unfettered, unregulated corporatism/fascism run amok.
Tush and Cheney tried desperately to destroy government, even going as far as to attempt privatizing Social Security, which thankfully bombed.
Then they want to point at government at election time and shout "look, it's broken, it doesn't work!" when in reality government works very well, thank you, when Democrats are in charge, not so much when you have abusive Repugnicans in charge. :mad:
ccbatson
May-12-09, 03:49 PM
If I am a "sheeple"...the name that you called me...who is the shepherd?
oladub
May-12-09, 04:42 PM
Lomax, "Tush and Cheney tried desperately to destroy government"
No they didn't. They radically increased the size of government as measured by the increase in government spending and debt, war, wiretapping, and other Patriot Act personal liberty and privacy restrictions created by their administration . Maybe its not the sort of government that you or I prefer, but they did expand government.
Detroitej72
May-12-09, 06:24 PM
No they didn't. They radically increased the size of government as measured by the increase in government spending and debt, war, wiretapping, and other Patriot Act personal liberty and privacy restrictions created by their administration . Maybe its not the sort of government that you or I prefer, but they did expand government.
What they failed to realize was that their reign wouldn't last forever and a new regime would follow. They arrogantly thought their neo-con policies would ensure their party to remain in power, but the people had enough, and voted for a change in philosophy.
If I am a "sheeple"...the name that you called me...who is the shepherd?
Being a flaming liberal, I'll give you a choice:
Brush Lintball
Yawn Manatee
Mann Coultergeist
Glenda Speck
Michael Weener Savage
Poopert Murdoch
Shrill O'Reilly
John Boner
Sceric Cantor
There are a few religious nuts who share your desire to follow the leader, perhaps they would be more to your liking.
OldTub says:
No they didn't. They radically increased the size of government as measured by the increase in government spending and debt, war, wiretapping, and other Patriot Act personal liberty and privacy restrictions created by their administration . Maybe its not the sort of government that you or I prefer, but they did expand government.
Sorry, but increasing the size of government isn't mutually exclusive with destroying it.
The Repugnicans expanded government to suit the needs of the military/industrial complex as it relates to the businesses they favor, and then systematically set about destroying any agency set up by democrats, especially the legacy of FDR.
Why is it that the FDA was reduced in size by nearly 70%, so we can now enjoy the tainted imported foods from China, lead in toys, poisonous toothpaste, etc?
Why was the Interior Department de-funded, so our national parks, historic monuments, and even our former president's mansions allowed to deteriorate?
How about the de-funding of the interstate highway system?
I'll bet you don't have any federal roads in your area with potholes, do you?
Dangerous bridges, unsafe ports, open borders- all brought to us via the Repugnican Reich. Thanks guys!
ccbatson
May-31-09, 11:42 PM
Expanding government has always led to declines in quality of life for it's citizens. Not mutually exclusive with destruction? Are you sure?
Expanding government has always led to declines in quality of life for it's citizens. Not mutually exclusive with destruction? Are you sure?
Hmmm, including the Interstate system?
Zoning?
rb336
June-01-09, 07:04 AM
Expanding government has always led to declines in quality of life for it's citizens. Not mutually exclusive with destruction? Are you sure?
ah, yes. sounds like someone who has never been to sweden, denmark, norway, france...
rb336
June-01-09, 07:07 AM
Hmmm, including the Interstate system?
Zoning?
Bats thinks it should be perfectly OK for me to build a smelter right next to his house
Expanding government has always led to declines in quality of life for it's citizens. Not mutually exclusive with destruction? Are you sure?
I knew you knew the war in Iraq was a mistake.
oladub
June-01-09, 10:02 AM
Expanding government has always led to declines in quality of life for it's citizens. Not mutually exclusive with destruction? Are you sure?
Not 'always'. Even though governments collectively killed more of their own citizens than those of wartime enemies during the 20th Century, government does produce some good things. Even the Soviet Union created the Bolshoi Ballet.
Our Constitution recognizes and authorizes the role of government to carry out a limited number of specified government functions while guaranteeing our individual rights. Were it observed, we wouldn't be entangled in so many wars and in national bankruptcy. To the extent that corruption exists, government will not work for the common good or be capable of efficiency. If Sweden elected the guys we elect, Sweden would be running huge debts policing the world, instead of something else, too.
DetroitDad
June-01-09, 01:57 PM
Hmmm, including the Interstate system?
Zoning?
That's a poor example. Have you seen the garbage buildings and parking lot oasis' that lead to?
Detroitej72
June-01-09, 06:24 PM
perhaps other than drug addict (sorta like the idiot in charge now eh?)you could possibly post some proof of that crap that spilled out of your mouth.
Why on earth do people like constantly bash people and tag them ridiculous labels such as above without any damn proof at all.
Its easy to tell who the Obamazombies are in this life.
Sad , sad story to tell.
Perhaps you could give some damn proof what drug Obama is supposedly addicted to?
As far as constantly bashing and tagging people, it seems that the right has a pretty good monopoly on these tactics, just look at all your right wing commentators and those of you on this form who call everyone who disagrees with them a socialist, communist, collectivist and, the right's favorite derogatory term, liberal.
Its easy to tell who the dittohead zombies are here!
ccbatson
June-01-09, 09:58 PM
I would take him at his word that he did experiment (a lot) in his youth, and doubt he carries any of those monkeys on his back today.
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