Caller calls Rush a "Brainwashed Nazi"

[Pam]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0lfpuCgmqM

[Bobl]

Heh, Heh, Heh!!!
The caller struck a nerve, and another chickenhawk got his sensibilities hurt.
My favorite part is when Rush, who never served, called the caller, who served in both the marines and army, ignorant.
The caller correctly called out the Limbaugh, Levine, Hannity crew for the sour grapes they have been spewing for months.

You lost this one on your terms, Rush. Quick....take some oxy, and mock a handicapped person. You'll feel better!

[firstandten]

I heard the call and the caller certainly called Rush out. Of course Rush and got in the last word while cutting him off. Rush's call screener must have fallen asleep on that one.

[gazhekwe]

Rush to caller: "You think you know everything... You are really ignorant ... You're an embarrassment..."

Really sounds like he is describing himself :p

[Johnlodge]

Rush's retort was basically to hang up on him and say "nuh-uh, you are!"

[Flanders]

Limbaugh knows that his hardcore listeners are gullible dittoheads, and all he really has to do is be the reassuring voice coming from the dashboard speaker that confirms, approves, confides, and expands on their fears, hatred, racism, bigotry and hypocrisy. He doesn't have to be truthful or fair and balanced. He doesn't have to mention anything good that Democrats or the Obama administration has or is doing in the US. He just focuses on spinnable subjects that have the greatest potential for making him look like a great lone wolf American patriot, defending and promoting wholesome conservative values and the GOP, while criticizing the corrupt liberal socialist and Democratic POV with only a mere microphone and a broadcast signal as the tools of his trade.

[MickeyMac]

The more serious minded of conservatives reject the loons like Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity, Coulter, O'Reilly, Savage, etc...

The problem is that serious minded conservatives are rare.



I like Ann Coulter, Sean Hannity and Bill O'Riley

[oladub]

Flanders, I think he should try to be truthful. However, you are quite correct that he doesn't have to be "fair and balanced" anymore than you have to be "fair and balanced" when dissing his fans. I also agree that "he doesn't have to mention anything good that Democrats or the Obama administration has or is doing in the US". No one has to listen to him and/or they can listen to Air America instead.

Since this thread started out mentioning "brainwashed nazi'", I wondered if one of the abundant Rush experts here knows whether Rush verbally supported Bush's Wall Street bailout. (?)

[Flanders]

Flanders, I think he should try to be truthful. However, you are quite correct that he doesn't have to be "fair and balanced" anymore than you have to be "fair and balanced" when dissing his fans. I also agree that "he doesn't have to mention anything good that Democrats or the Obama administration has or is doing in the US". No one has to listen to him and/or they can listen to Air America instead.

Since this thread started out mentioning "brainwashed nazi'", I wondered if one of the abundant Rush experts here knows whether Rush verbally supported Bush's Wall Street bailout. (?)

I dissed his hardcore dittohead fanbase, who IMO, are aptly named, and I am aware that there are likely many other listeners who do not accept everything he says as gospel, just as I do not avidly listen to and agree with everything Olbermann, Cenk, Maddow, et al have to say. I also read many topics and post on some liberal AND conservative websites, such as Townhall, Free Republic, Daily Kos, and Democratic Underground. I don't listen to biased talk radio at all, and prefer the internet to form and base my admittedly more politically left than Obama opinions. .

[Bullet]

Flanders, have you ever listened in to the show? I thought not. You paint with the broadest of brushes. But that is what every single one of Obama’s supporter do. I, on the other hand, would never make such sweeping generalizations.

[Flanders]

Flanders, have you ever listened in to the show? I thought not. You paint with the broadest of brushes. But that is what every single one of Obama’s supporter do. I, on the other hand, would never make such sweeping generalizations.


Never?

446

[Detroit Stylin]

Flanders, have you ever listened in to the show? I thought not. You paint with the broadest of brushes. But that is what every single one of Obama’s supporter do. I, on the other hand, would never make such sweeping generalizations.



LMBAO talk about double talk.......lol

[Jimaz]

It's as if the GOP is now held together with only a zipper but they keep zipping it open when they should be zipping it closed. The zipper has only a finite length and they're playing a game of chicken to see which half of the GOP finds the end of the zipper first. Armageddon politics! LOL!

Was the caller (a McCain voter) sincerely advising Rush or not? It seemed he was at least trying to appear to help Rush with constructive criticism.

[Detroitej72]

quote:
You paint with the broadest of brushes.



You seem to miss the point that all Rushie does is paint with broad brushes.

[Jimaz]

Not quite as broad and glaringly obvious as the one Flanders bolded.

That big GOP tent collected a few too many who aren't helping their cause ... and don't even know it.

[ccbatson]

Brainwashed by whom? Nazi? In what sense? Not in the sense that he endorses free enterprise, individual liberty, and smaller government...all polar opposites of Naziism.

This is what is meant by ignorant, no matter what the service record of the caller might be.

[HPGrmln]

I have listened to it - what I could stomach of it. When I criticize it, the connies say "Oh yeah, well YOU listen to NPR". Like that is some sort of apt comparison. If there is something on the left as that is as full of bile and self-important bullshit, I am not aware of it.


In absolute honesty, I think the opinions of some of the leftists on this site are totally the most offensive, vicious, inhumane filth I have ever heard ANYONE speak about another group.

[ccbatson]

Welcome HPGrmin...let's give them heck.

[HPGrmln]

Examples please? You're going to need to back up your wild claims.

Such drama!

Like the comments about McCains supporters all being drooling, incoherent, confused alzheimers patients?

Any post by our friend Alan55

[Pam]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/04/07/republican-caller-tells-l_n_184244.html

Link with a written transcript for people like Bats who apparently didn't listen to the first link.



In absolute honesty, I think the opinions of some of the leftists on this site are totally the most offensive, vicious, inhumane filth I have ever heard ANYONE speak about another group.


Speaking of offensive-were you here during the days of conservative posters like Karl, Craigd, Perfectgentleman and Steelers? There wasn't anything nice and polite about those guys. I think they set the tone for negative attacks which were responded to in kind.

[rb336]

In absolute honesty, I think the opinions of some of the leftists on this site are totally the most offensive, vicious, inhumane filth I have ever heard ANYONE speak about another group.

example? you are totally full of it

[ghettopalmetto]

I will admit that I lean a bit to the left of center. I understand the principles of conservatism, though, and actually subscribe to several of them.

Rush Limbaugh is no conservative. Conservatism has an intellectual basis. William F. Buckley was a conservative. Theodore Roosevelt was a conservative. Ronald Wilson Reagan and his worshippers are rooted in decidedly anti-intellectual, emotionally-based reactions to concepts they don't understand--which is a great deal of things, considering they tend not to have any curiosity about anything different than what they already think they know.

[HPGrmln]

That's the cruelest and most horrible thing you've ever heard anyone say to someone else? LOL!!!!!

How is that worse than conservatives calling democrats socialists, who hate America, embolden our enemies, calling Obama a terrorist who wants to destroy America, had homosexual relations, isn't American, saying Kerry shot himself in the leg ot get out of vietnam, calling anyone who supports Al Gore's global warming science an idiot, calling Michael Moore a big fat, anti-American idiot, etc, etc, etc...

Kid, you obviously weren't here when Perfectgentleman and Craigd were here.


How is callling someone a socialist negative? If someone embraces aspects of socialism, calling it as one sees it isnt exactly demeaning.Why is the medical system many think he wants to implement called "SOCIALIZED medicine"? When Obama goes overseas and criticizes the country he is suppossed to be loyal to, he and his fans have to expect some people to truly question just how much he likes the country.Many people feel he backstabbed his constituents.How is it slanderous if the speak about something that deeply offended them? If his actions truly offend or anger Americans, well, there are repercussions.Al Gore? There are still many scientists who complete disagree.I wouldnt call anyone who believes it an idiot, but I think partisan bias clearly plays a role in who some choose to believe and who to ignore altogether.And Michael Moore IS anti-American.He said Americans voters are the stupidest people in the world. He also scolded another country for trying to emulate America, saying "thats like taking a piss on yourself".

I remember PG and Craig, and believe they were exagerrating a lot of the "far-right" stereotypes knowing it would piss off people reading them. They knew how to bring attention to themselves.

Personally, Im just getting really tired of people on the left accusing those on the right of being "racist". Thats a powerful word.And I don't believe it's true. I haven't exactly seen the Democrats or Liberals helping minorities. In fact, it was Republicans who passed civil rights bills. As long as democrats have KKK-alumni Robert Byrd (im not slandering, its a well-documented fact, look it up) on their side, its hypocritical to accuse their opponents of racism. Then, theres the constant attacks on here about Republicans being "greedy" and money-grabbing. Blanket statements one and all. Why no vitriol about Pelosi's numerous big-buck buisness ventures that wouldn't even allow union labor (see the book "Do As I Say, Not As I Do" by Peter Scweitzer) or her corporate jet? What about the Kennedys deep pockets? Theres plenty of blame on both sides to go around. But more than a few on these posts very carefully select who they will single out to give a mouthful to.

[ghettopalmetto]

As I stated....

[gencinjay]

How is callling someone a socialist negative? If someone embraces aspects of socialism, calling it as one sees it isnt exactly demeaning.Why is the medical system many think he wants to implement called "SOCIALIZED medicine"? When Obama goes overseas and criticizes the country he is suppossed to be loyal to, he and his fans have to expect some people to truly question just how much he likes the country.

Unfortunately, newspeople like Rush have made words like socialist and liberal into dirty words in the minds of many. They have the attitude as Rush showed in the sound clip that if you disagree with me then you are an idiot.

As for the second part, I could turn that around. Obama is our president now and people should respect him. He is the leader of our country. Do we now question anyones patriotism that speaks bad about him? The people that were so up in arms about any negative comment the Obamas made about the country's policies are often the same people that will complain about many of his policies. How is this different?

Many people on both sides of the political spectrum are too quick to ridicule and bash those with different opinions. It's as if people forget that it's our differences in opinion and the willingness to come together someplace in the middle is what truely makes this country great.

[ghettopalmetto]

That's precisely the problem, though. People like Rush and his sheep have no interest in "meeting in the middle".

[GOAT]

Good people get shot every day and yet fat fuck addicts like Limbaugh are still around to annoy. Just like cockroaches...

[firstandten]

With Rush getting $38 million a year with an extension thru 2016 equaling $400 million plus a $100million signing bonus it makes it real easy for him to actually believe that crap he gives out to the public. No wonder why we have so many conservative talkers out there whether they believe in the stuff there are talking about. It doesn't make a difference there is some serious dollars out there.

Makes it a lot easier to be a patriot when you make that kind of money.

[Gistok]

In absolute honesty, I think the opinions of some of the leftists on this site are totally the most offensive, vicious, inhumane filth I have ever heard ANYONE speak about another group.

HP... but that is still rather tame as compared to Limgbaugh and Coultier, isn't it??

When it comes to offensive, vicious and inhumane filth... it's hard to top Ann Coultier's condescending comments about the 9/11 widows...

So you might want to keep that in mind the next time you call this forum trash talk...

[East Detroit]

Limbaugh is not brainwashed. Sheesh.

[Bigb23]

With Rush getting $38 million a year with an extension thru 2016 equaling $400 million plus a $100million signing bonus

After an extensive hour long search on Google, this all I could find on Rush's charitable donations. Geeze - Rush, don't break your bank account. Especially after a hefty tax break. :confused:


By Stephanie Strom, New York Times News Service | October 20, 2007

NEW YORK - After Rush Limbaugh referred to Iraq war veterans critical of the war as "phony soldiers," he received a letter of complaint signed by 41 Democratic senators. He decided to auction the letter, which he described as "this glittering jewel of colossal ignorance," for charity, and he pledged to match the price, dollar for dollar.

On Thursday night, Limbaugh, the conservative radio talk show host, said he thought the letter would bring in as much as $1 million. He was wrong.

When the eBay auction closed yesterday, the winning bid was $2.1 million. It is the largest amount ever paid for an item sold on eBay to benefit a charity.


http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/10/20/limbaugh_blasting_letter_sent_by_democrats_sells_f or_21m_to_aid_charity/

[jiminnm]

Bigb, after an exhaustive 5 second Google search, I found this:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2083034/posts

[HPGrmln]

So liberal posters who say outrageous things are indicative of all liberals? Yet conservative posters who say even more outrageous things are just saying it to piss people off and can't be taken seriously? LOL! You're funny!

SOrry pally, but Obama and democrats aren't socialists. If you think they are, its obvious that you don't know what the word means. Especially when more wealthy voters supported Obama and he also got more corporate donations.


LOL! Funny how when a democrat criticizes GOP policies it means "They are criticizing their country", but a republican spewing trash about a democrat president is ok.

Obama did NOT criticize his country. That is absurd!


The majority of scientists agree with Gore. Still even if you disagree, does that give conservatives the right to slander an defame those who support him?

Partisan bias has nothing to do with the global warming debate. Many prominent republicans support global warming action. Its not a political debate. Only radical conservatives made it one!

"Michael Moore IS anti-American.He said Americans voters are the stupidest people in the world."

Rush Limbaugh said the same thing yesterday. Does that mean Rush Limbaugh is an anti-American? In fact the audio of that statement is above.

"Personally, Im just getting really tired of people on the left accusing those on the right of being "racist""

Go to the storm front site to see why those on the left say that. Also Google Rush Limbaugh's "Barack the magic Negro" quote.


"As long as democrats have KKK-alumni Robert Byrd"

He joined the KKK when he was 15. So criticisms about Bush's service are wrong because it happened a long time ago, but criticisms about Byrd are valid? LMFAO!!!!!!

Thanks for bringing up Pelosi. There are daily hate attacks against her.
But of course, you're a poor innocent victim who never did anything to anyone, right?

I think you are being very silly about this topic. Conservatives by no means are poor innocent victims. All you have to do is turn on conservative hate radio to hear the most vile, disgusting and horrible things you'll ever hear anyone say about another group.


If someone keeps railing against the CEOs of privately-owned companies or shareholder owned companies and demands salary caps on guys who arent being paid by taxpayer dollars, but want to take that money in the form of taxes and give it to special interests, what is that called? Ok, maybe not socialism. Give it your own name then. And "Socialized medicine"- the name says it all.

Calling America "arrogant" and talking about its people being self-centered is not "criticizing GOP policy". Its badmouthing the population.

If democrats/liberals want to shout about political opposites being "racist", they should not be voting for a kkk-alumni. It is just as relevant as Bush's service. You CANNOT claim to be the party that champions the minorities if you continue electing a former kkk member. Sorry. You just cant. The Democrats need to give him the boot and do a hell of a lot more to condemn him. You cant just say "oh its in the past, forgive him" then dredge up arguments about conservative racism by people who never even belonged to a bona-fide hate group. Bush, Cheney, Limbaugh, etc. never belonged to a blatantly racist organization whose sole purpose was to keep a certain race oppressed and threaten their families. I am pretty damn sure the Republican party would ostracize and disassociate themselves from a klansman.Supporting and electing a former Klansman sends a weak message about fighting discrimination.

Pelosi? She strongly endorses unions and environmentalism but she and her husband have invested billions into ecologically destructive buisness projects and refsed to allow unionization. What does your defense about her having attack threats have to do with the fact that there are serious discrepencies between her public comments/causes and what she actually uses her deep pockets for. Its hard to defend someone of such dubious standards. Defend her criticism of the Auto CEOs using a plane and her environmentalism vs her own fuel-gulping, eco-unfriendly jumbo jet. Can't the democrats find someone of stronger virtue and integrity?

Conservatives are not 100% pure or innocent. But if you think the democrats are superior in honesty and ethics, then you need to expand your sources.

Oh, I bet Howard Deans allegations of "the white mens party" isnt in the least bit offensive or racist in your view? And saying "Republicans haven't worked an honest day in their life" is tasteful and taking the high road? And making fun of Limbaugh in front of a group of people by imitating someone snorting cocaine? THAT is unacceptable. I have NEVER heard an allegation of Limbaugh using coke. Pills and coke arent the same drug, and to imply someone is a cokehead is irresponsible. I guarantee the GOP would never put someone like that in charge of the party. They will not elect smeone who runs off at the mouth with inflammatory, inaccurate rhetoric.

Lastly, during the election, one poster here made a crack about McCain having skin cancer. Wow. Clever. What if someone on the right made a joke about Ted kennedys illness? But its okay to wisecrack about McCain being "one case of melanoma" from death. You dont think thats vicious? I TRULY cant recall anyone cracking on a left-winger about their ailments in such a cold, careless manner

[Bigb23]

Bigb, after an exhaustive 5 second Google search, I found this:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2083034/posts

After an exhaustive search on your link, I found this. And half of that Rush Limbaugh donation was a letter from the Democratic Congressmen that was sold on Ebay back in 2007. Does Herb Alpert make anywhere near what Rush has made ? Spend an hour searching on line and find something else.



2. Herb Alpert, $13 million.
"The Herb Alpert Foundation: music education, including the UCLA Herb Alpert School of Music"

10. Rush Limbaugh, $4.2 million.
"Financial assistance to the children of Marines and law-enforcement officers killed in the line of duty."


I'm waiting to hear.

[ccbatson]

Look up the word socialism yourself DSF...think about it, apply the Obama agenda of bailouts, corporate taxation, growth of government, class envy, and then draw the only possible logical conclusion.

[mauser]

I, on the other hand, would never make such sweeping generalizations.

Um....Isn't that in itself a rather sweeping generalization ?

Rush is not a brainwashed Nazi.

Rush is one of the Nazi brainwashers.

Get it straight folks.

[Pam]

I think some of the call screeners on these shows must have been laid off.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXfr9f6fC2A

[MoparDan]

I think some of the call screeners on these shows must have been laid off.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXfr9f6fC2A

My favorite line: "Why isn't he in uniform?" Exactly! They can talk the talk, but can't walk the walk.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/65/OperationChickenhawk.jpg

[jiminnm]

What's your point, Bigb? I'm not defending or crticizing Limbaugh's charity. Whatever the answer, it's irrelevant to anything else discussed here. All those folks, including Limbaugh, are celebrities. They make a whole lot of money and can do what they want with it. They are under no obligation to give any away, or report to anyone (but the IRS) if they do.

To answer your question, I expect herb Alpert has some sizeable multiple of Limbaugh's wealth. Alpert sold 80+ million albums when recording and performing and performed thousands of concerts. He created and owned (with a partner) A&M Records in the early 1960s. They recorded so many best selling records it's impossible to name them. Alpert received $250-300 million when A&M was sold in the 1980s. He's been giving millions to his charity for years, probably so it isn't lost to the govt when he dies (as is Warren Buffet).

[Blarf]

It would have been funnier if the caller poked fun at Limbaugh's Oxycontin addiction.

Calling someone a Nazi is so cliche and rather lame.

[Bigb23]

What's your point, Bigb?

"With Rush getting $38 million a year with an extension thru 2016 equaling $400 million plus a $100million signing bonus"

My point is that a guy who mocks the less fortunate in society, (i.e. the homeless guy who was crushed to death, sleeping in a dumpster), for humor and profit on the radio, has a pretty piss poor record of charitable donations to the society that allows him that chance.
You're right, he can do anything with his money that he wants. But as a celebrity, it's out there for people to comment on.

[ccbatson]

He mocks the institutionalization of the "less fortunate" which creates and imprisons individuals in this role.

[HPGrmln]

Just because suppossed "capitalist" nations have socialized medicine does not mean its good.As much as I like Canada and its people, their system sucks.Ive talked about it to numerous Canadians visiting Detroit. They dont like waiting over a month to see a doctor.All the best doctors are out of system. And if it was so good, why do a bunch of canadian nurses cross the border every day to get medical jobs HERE? I dont see a bunch of Americans going oer the bridge every day for jobs at Windsor or Sarnia hospitals.

And you have to be joking about "Howling" Howard Dean.That guy DID NOT assemble a great party. Bush was so controversial and polarizing enough people just wanted something completely oppositte of him. Even if it was the Democrats themselves that won, it was Obama who got people voting Democrat and volunteering/registering. I never liked Dean as a person. I always thought he was a cocky, brash, uncouth, tactless bully.He reminds me of the kind of guy who goes onto the field at his sons little-league game and punches the coach.His politics aside, I find him hard to like and nothing short of a bottom-feeding a**hole. To make my case: I disagree with Dennis Archer on every position. I was extremely dissapointed to read on fundrace.org that he donated money to the campaign of racist extraordinaire Al Sharpton.However, I have great respect for him as a person and his service to the community.I disagree with Robert Ficanos politics, but I do not dislike him as a person.Both are more than welcome to bring a 12 pack of Pepsi to my backyard barbeque and make themselves at home. I didn't like Howard Dean BEFORE I was even aware of his policies. I strongly doubt he had much to do with his parties success.The man is a disgrace and a jerk and the party would have won without him.

[Big Dog]

HP, You seem like you are a very hateful person. It appears you have no moral or spiritual grounds, and a narrow minded outlook on life and people. You shout it in your posts, the way you are so critical and judgemental. Lighten up, will you?

[ccbatson]

Deeper thought..why was that person homeless and in a dumpster?

Every Canadian I know has choice words regarding the state of the Canadian socialized medicine system as it falls deeper into decline.

Heck, this is Detroit, drive over to Windsor and ask a few folks for yourself.

[HPGrmln]

HP, You seem like you are a very hateful person. It appears you have no moral or spiritual grounds, and a narrow minded outlook on life and people. You shout it in your posts, the way you are so critical and judgemental. Lighten up, will you?

I never used to be this way. But you get really frustrated and angry after hearing people use the same tired talking points to rip on every single aspect of anyone with philosophical differences. "That guys a conservative, that means he's a bigot and wants everyone to suffer." No conservative can do a single good deed in the minds of all these countless people, who cannot bring themselves to open their minds and admit that their political opposites are not the otherworldy monsters they make themselves to be. Im angry because I live in severley polarized country where too many people think its impossible that any good can come from someone elses side. Im getting angry because people are putting party affiliation before anything else and are blindly loyal to a party that is more flawed than they like to think. Im getting angry because we can't put political signs on our private property without narrow-minded loyalists stealing or even burning them. Im pissed that I had a political bumper sticker on my car supporting the Republican candidate and someone walked onto my private property and pulled it off my personal vehicle in the middle of the night, and far too many people of their mindset publicly condone this. I do not know even one person who tampered with anyones property containing an advertisement for a Democratic candidate. I hear story after story of conservatives being publicly reviled and harrassed, but never liberals or conservatives being harrassed in the same vein.If I sound angry, its because Im tired of the blatant disregard people have for anyone whos views dont fit within their personal narrow mindset and refuse to listen to opposing viewpoints with calm, friendly dialogue, or without violating personal privacy or private property rights.

[Jimaz]

Magnanimity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnanimity) is more natural for the noble than the ignoble.

[Bigb23]

But you get really frustrated and angry after hearing people use the same tired talking points to rip on every single aspect of anyone with philosophical differences.

Now you know how we feel with Cc. I read everything that's on here, because they have points to make. But I have only de-listed one person. A one trick pony can only go so far.

[Jimaz]

psychological projection (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_projection)

[HPGrmln]

Nope. http://www.mediamouse.org/news/2008/09/ku-klux-klan-me.php

Also, you seem to have forgotten Strom Thurmond. Did Trent Lott (R) "ostracize and distance himself" from him when he said "When Strom Thurmond ran for president, we voted for him. We’re proud of it. And if the rest of the country had followed our lead, we wouldn't have had all these problems over the years, either."

If I recall correctly, though, the republican party quickly distanced themselves from Trent Lott solely because of that comment. And thats fair. Strom Thurmond was probably largely responsible for the shaky image the party has with blacks. The party still has a lot of making up to do, and Lott set them back a few decades.At least his career suffered for it, and thats partially why I think the party would distance themselves from anyone else of that mindset.

[Jimaz]

From today's Free Press: Down and out GOP struggles for focus (http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2009904120486)
WASHINGTON -- Republicans have spent the first hundred days of the 111th Congress mostly down and shut out.

While there's a realistic hope that they will be more involved in some upcoming policy decisions, the GOP still has a long way to go before the public sees it as constructive and cohesive rather than obstructionist and unruly.

"There are seasons in politics, and right now it's winter for the Republicans," said Jack Pitney, a congressional expert at Claremont McKenna College in California.

Polls indicate that the Republicans' approval ratings remain dismal: A March 27-29 Gallup poll found the congressional GOP approval rating at 30%, down 6 percentage points from a month earlier.

"The real issue is that the party is not being seen as constructive. They're not seen as voicing solutions to problems," said Andrew Kohut, president of the Pew Research Center. "People don't feel they understand what Republicans stand for -- not even members of the party."

A Pew poll taken March 31-April 6 found that only 41% of Republicans thought the party had clearly explained its opposition to Democratic initiatives, while 42% said it hadn't explained things clearly enough....

[ccbatson]

They are running a resistance movement in exile waiting for the opportunity (provided by the failures of the liberals) at the next elections. True freedom fighters.

[ccbatson]

Hopefully more successful and with a much more noble cause.

[rb336]

Hopefully more successful and with a much more noble cause.

so -- more totalitarian, more repressive and more brutal -- as long as it's for "your" ignoble cause

[ccbatson]

We are exiled from elected office (not the country)...for now.

Fighting for individual liberty cannot be mistaken for totalitarianism (or repressive)...they are opposites.

[Blarf]

I'm still waiting for Rush to volunteer to serve his lengthy prison sentence. Since he has always said drug offenders need harsher penalties, he shouldn't have any objection to serving his time.

[Detroitej72]

I'm still waiting for Rush to volunteer to serve his lengthy prison sentence. Since he has always said drug offenders need harsher penalties, he shouldn't have any objection to serving his time.

He clearly thinks he is too important to serve any time. Kind of like how Cheney said he was too busy to serve in Nam. Conservatives can be such hypicrites.

[ccbatson]

It isn't what he thinks, it is whether or not charges were pressed and he were convicted to serve time...he was not.

[Redford Kid]

ex⋅ile   /ˈɛghttp://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/luna/thinsp.pngzaɪl, ˈɛkhttp://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/luna/thinsp.pngsaɪl/ http://cache.lexico.com/g/d/dictionary_questionbutton_default.gif (http://dictionary.reference.com/help/luna/IPA_pron_key.html) Show Spelled Pronunciation [eg-zahyl, ek-sahyl] http://cache.lexico.com/g/d/dictionary_questionbutton_default.gif (http://dictionary.reference.com/help/luna/Spell_pron_key.html) Show IPA noun, verb, -iled, -il⋅ing.
–noun 1.expulsion from one's native land by authoritative decree.2.the fact or state of such expulsion: to live in exile. 3.a person banished from his or her native land.4.prolonged separation from one's country or home, as by force of circumstances: wartime exile. 5.anyone separated from his or her country or home voluntarily or by force of circumstances.6.the Exile, the Babylonian captivity of the Jews, 597–538 b.c.
–verb (used with object) 7.to expel or banish (a person) from his or her country; expatriate.8.to separate from country, home, etc.: Disagreements exiled him from his family.

exile (http://www.reference.com/browse/columbia/exile)
exile, removal of a national from his or her country, or the civilized parts of it, for a long period of time or for life. Exile may be a forceful expulsion by the government or a voluntary removal by the citizen, sometimes in order to escape punishment. In ancient Greece, exile was often the penalty for homicide, while ostracism (http://www.reference.com/browse/columbia/ostracis) was a common punishment for those accused of political crimes. In early Rome a citizen under sentence of death had a choice between exile and death. In this case, exile was a means of escaping a greater punishment. During the Roman Empire, deportation to certain islands became a general punishment for serious crimes. The ancient Hebrews allowed those who committed homicide to take refuge in designated cities of sanctuary. Until 1776, certain types of English criminals were transported to the American colonies, and later, until 1853, they were sent to penal settlements in Australia. Both the Russian czarist and Communist regimes have transported prisoners to Siberia. With the growth of nation-states and the acceptance of the doctrine that ties between state and citizen are indissoluble, exile for criminal reasons has become infrequent. However, modern civil wars and revolutions have produced many political exiles, including large numbers of refugees who have been victims of the upheavals in some manner. Such exiles are not subject to extradition (http://www.reference.com/browse/columbia/extradit) and may demand protection from the country receiving them. The concept of "government in exile"—one person or a group of persons living outside their state and claiming to be the rightful government—has become accepted in international law during the 20th cent. This situation usually arises when a warring state is occupied by the enemy and its government is forced to seek asylum (http://www.reference.com/browse/columbia/asylum) in another state. The government is recognized as lawful if it attempts to regain control and if it has armed forces integrated in a large alliance. During World War II, the monarchs and governments of Norway, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, Belgium (without the king), and Yugoslavia were exiled in London, while the governments of Charles de Gaulle of France and Eduard Beneš of Czechoslovakia were formed in exile. See deportation (http://www.reference.com/browse/columbia/deportat); refugee (http://www.reference.com/browse/columbia/refugee).
The Columbia Electronic Encyclopedia Copyright © 2004.
Licensed from Columbia University Press


CCBATSON you were only voted out, and you are part of the minority of a functioning government.

[sumas]

To be honest, I never waste time listening to Rush. We do have a friend who religiously catches his program. I think he calls it, his comedy hour.

[ccbatson]

Redford-kid...I realize that, just exercising a little artistic license for effect.

[firstandten]

"Artistic license" is what Republicans call it when they use hyperbole and conjecture instead of reason and facts.


Back in the day didn't they use to call that "telling a lie"

[ccbatson]

Look at this...I throw the liberals a nut, and they go crazy. You must be starved. Anyway....it is semantics and open to a bit of license. Voted out and in a minority versus exile....no lie in using either expression.

[Detroitej72]

It isn't what he thinks, it is whether or not charges were pressed and he were convicted to serve time...he was not.

Maybe he never served time because there is a different standard of justice if you can afford good lawyers, think back to OJ or Kenny Lay.

[ccbatson]

An elitist? Where did you come to think I was alleging that of you?

[Redford Kid]

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Be a sport cbatson :cool:

[ccbatson]

As I thought, a baseless allegation....again.

[Blarf]

Has Rush accepted Ron Pauls challenge to debate yet, or is he still being a pussy?

[Detroitej72]

That will never happen, as Rush is a neo-con Republican apologist who cares little for Libertarian-leaning politicians like Paul.

[ccbatson]

I would like to see that debate...both have some solid points. Paul's weakness on defense vis a vis Iraq is now a moot point. As such, I bet Rush and Paul would be very close on many many issues.

[Detroitej72]

I would like to see that debate...both have some solid points. Paul's weakness on defense vis a vis Iraq is now a moot point. As such, I bet Rush and Paul would be very close on many many issues.

For the most part, the Libertarian Party feels we are better off as isolationists, so I guess Paul is pretty much in lock step with their platform. When you connect the dots, you'll see he is not weak at all.

[Blarf]

I don't agree with Ron Paul on everything, but his arguments and voting records are very consistent.

I don't get why Rush says Ron Paul ran for president under a 3rd party when he was running under the Republican ticket, but either way I'd like to see them go at it.

I think this is one of the interviews where he says he would challenge Rush, (even though the guy giving the interview is a ..........)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HEmgs8BX04

[ccbatson]

Paul is/was a Libertarian, and therefore, his bid as a Republican makes him a RINO.

Isolationism, and weakness on defense are the tragic and fatal flaws making the Libertarian party a nonviable entity....If only they softened on those points, then we would really have something new and exciting to get behind.

[Blarf]

I don't think Ron Paul is an isolationist or weak on defense, he just has a different philosophy on foreign policy and how we should approach it.

One thing Ron Paul and Rush Limbaugh have in common is that things they say played in 30 second clips can be taken well out of context.

[Lorax]

In absolute honesty, I think the opinions of some of the leftists on this site are totally the most offensive, vicious, inhumane filth I have ever heard ANYONE speak about another group.

Try this on for size-

Lush Lintball is nothing more than a bloviating drug addled gas bag. That's on his best days.

The rest of the time he's just the Caftan Warlord de facto pez-head of the repugnican party, dispensing nuggets of fascist right wing vomit on demand.

Anyone who could take any of the Murdoch Fascists seriously are themselves socially retarded.

Hey all you Lush Lovers, been walking upright long? :D

[Lorax]

He mocks the institutionalization of the "less fortunate" which creates and imprisons individuals in this role.


Boy, you can sure put a spin on something so obviously slanted and negative and try turning it into a silk purse.

Reality check: Limbaugh has HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS- he's an elitist thug who wears caftans and powdered wigs while wafting around in his Louis XV style palace in Palm Beach- I have this on good authority from someonw who works for this freakshow, and I live only a couple of miles away.

He and Giuliani could make one freaky dragshow.

[Lorax]

Paul is/was a Libertarian, and therefore, his bid as a Republican makes him a RINO.

Isolationism, and weakness on defense are the tragic and fatal flaws making the Libertarian party a nonviable entity....If only they softened on those points, then we would really have something new and exciting to get behind.

Get behind what? Giuliani in a dress? Limbaugh in the limbo line at his next blow party?

Libertarianism is nothing more than repugnicans who want legalized drugs and no legal or moral consequences for sleeping with underage girls.

[Redford Kid]

Our equivalent to Hermann Goring.........Rush.

[ccbatson]

Limbaugh is not, and likely will not, be running for public office....we have to get behind true conservative principles and politicians that employ them as their rules of conduct.

[Blarf]

If I could ask Rush a question, I would ask why he against the use of medical marijuana.

He says the FDA has reported no medical qualities of the drug, while claiming to be against federal bureaucracies, while claiming to defend personal liberties against big government, and also while becoming addicted to and illegally using the prescription drug Oxycontin.

[jams]

Limbaugh is not, and likely will not, be running for public office....we have to get behind true conservative principles and politicians that employ them as their rules of conduct.
No, we don't.

[Big Dog]

Not exiled, but waterboarded 183 times.

[Lorax]

Limbaugh is not, and likely will not, be running for public office....we have to get behind true conservative principles and politicians that employ them as their rules of conduct.


Let me see.... true conservative values and rules of conduct let's ask:

Sarah Palin & her daughter Bristol
Newt Gingrich, his wife and girlfriend
David Vitter and his hookers
Bill Bennett and his gambling addiction
Dick Cheney and his love of torture
Dick Morris and his fetish for the toes of black hookers
Saxby Chambliss and his smear campaign against war hero Max Cleland
Bill Frist and his ill-gotten billions ripping off Medicare
John McCain and his associations with domestic terrorist G. Gordon Liddy
Any and all so-called Christians who have TV shows and operate mega-churches- charlatans all of them.

Need we go on?:eek:

[Lorax]

Those aren't "true conservatives", they are "secret liberals". {spin, spin, spin}

I guess an argument could be made for that! LOL:D

[ccbatson]

Try Goldwater, Reagan, Romney, and a good handful of present day libertarians.

[gibran]

i guess we should judge him by those supporters...like Cheney

[Lorax]

Try Goldwater, Reagan, Romney, and a good handful of present day libertarians.

Reagan was a lousy president, Goldwater was no more a conservative in the modern sense of neocon fascist than Mickey Mouse.

Romney, the only one of your three still living, believes in magic underpants as part of his backward religion.

That, and he was cited by PETA for animal cruelty for taking a road trip with his family in 20 degree weather with the family's dog in a cage mounted to the roof of the station wagon. The animal nearly died.

Just another super rich right wing fascist blowhard who's fortunes were made on the backs of fired working class people.

[rb336]

Try Goldwater, Reagan, Romney, and a good handful of present day libertarians.


ahhh...
reagan who introduced that timelessly conservative method of spending beyond your means, Romney who introduced state-sponsored health care and numerous other items as Mass governor, but quickly turned on his own creations to try to win the repub nomination, and AuH2O who wrote some rather condeming things about reaganites

[Detroitej72]

Let me see.... true conservative values and rules of conduct let's ask:

Sarah Palin & her daughter Bristol
Newt Gingrich, his wife and girlfriend
David Vitter and his hookers
Bill Bennett and his gambling addiction
Dick Cheney and his love of torture
Dick Morris and his fetish for the toes of black hookers
Saxby Chambliss and his smear campaign against war hero Max Cleland
Bill Frist and his ill-gotten billions ripping off Medicare
John McCain and his associations with domestic terrorist G. Gordon Liddy
Any and all so-called Christians who have TV shows and operate mega-churches- charlatans all of them.

Need we go on?:eek:

Also add:
Tom Foley and his love of under aged pages, while claiming to champion against pedophiles
Larry Craig and his love of gay restroom sex
Bill O'Reily and his love of phone sex
George Bush, who never served a day in combat smearing war hero John Kerry

This is too easy....

[ccbatson]

I will concede that many RINOs are very far from where we need conservatives to be...a golden opportunity in the making.

[Danny]

Rush Linbaugh, sought that the neo-cons are a laughing stock in the U.S. political system. He continues to attack every last neo-cons until they wake up and smell reality.

[Lorax]

I will concede that many RINOs are very far from where we need conservatives to be...a golden opportunity in the making.

Hey Battyacid, I've got some golden opportunity for your guys, let me just finish this six pack first.:eek:

[ccbatson]

You do know that name calling is a no no on this forum don't you Lorax? Check the rules.

[Big Dog]

I'll bet you snitched on him already too. It's your MO.

[Lorax]

Also add:
Tom Foley and his love of under aged pages, while claiming to champion against pedophiles
Larry Craig and his love of gay restroom sex
Bill O'Reily and his love of phone sex
George Bush, who never served a day in combat smearing war hero John Kerry

This is too easy....

Why is it that Repugnican congressmen don't use bookmarks?

Thy simply bend over the pages. :eek:

[Lorax]

You do know that name calling is a no no on this forum don't you Lorax? Check the rules.


Examples please.

If you are referring to my varied alterations of your name, and you have an objection to it, let me know.

I've been labeled "Borax" "Whorax" "Exlax" "Flomax", etc. It's all in good fun- why do you have such a thin skin- as a neocon you must support torture, eh, tough guy? :D

[Lorax]

That is, assuming he's an adult. :confused:

[ccbatson]

It is not a matter of my objections (or absence there of)...it is a cardinal rule of the board. Best not to be guilty of the violation...regardless if others are (many of whom are not welcome any longer because of it)

[Lorax]

It is not a matter of my objections (or absence there of)...it is a cardinal rule of the board. Best not to be guilty of the violation...regardless if others are (many of whom are not welcome any longer because of it)

Do I detect a veiled threat?

Sounds to me like Batts is gonna crap in the sandbox so none of us will want to play. :eek:

[ccbatson]

Veiled? What is veiled about stating the rules and pointing out that you are in violation?? I suggest you avoid repeat offenses before the consequences catch up with you. BTW, I am not a moderator or administrator of this board, so I have nothing to threaten with.

[Lorax]

Who made you the thread police?

There is nothing in my posts that could be considered personal attacks.

Offensive, perhaps, but then again that goes for your posts as well.

You're not able to keep up with me on the rhetoric, so you want to blow up game?

[ccbatson]

NAME CALLING, not personal attacks...that is/was your violation.

I took it upon myself to point it out to you as it was me that you were calling a name.

[Lorax]

NAME CALLING, not personal attacks...that is/was your violation.

I took it upon myself to point it out to you as it was me that you were calling a name.

Then you probably deserved it.

I thought repugnicans were thicker skinned then that, sorry if I offended your sensibilities. :eek:

[ccbatson]

I am thick skinned, the rules of this board were establish for reasons known to the owners. Presumably to make it a strong and popular forum. In the spirit and faith of those intentions, the community participating is obliged to follow the rules, or take their business elsewhere.

[rb336]

He was? I've never heard that. Regardless of whether that is true or just unsubstantiated rumor, it has no place here

[ccbatson]

It isn't a matter of "deserve"...it is a matter of how the owners of this site wish their intellectual property to be run.

[4real]

WOW, some caller called Rush a Nazi, how cute. The left is so adept at name calling it amazes me.

What about KKK Robert Bird of W VA?, longtime top member of the slavery party.

[ccbatson]

Aren't all old Democrat's former members of racist organizations?

[mjs]

I believe David Duke ran in the Republican primary.

[Pam]

WOW, some caller called Rush a Nazi, how cute. The left is so adept at name calling it amazes me


The guy who called him that was a Republican. Go back and read the Huffington Post link on the first page.

[Detroitej72]

Aren't all old Democrat's former members of racist organizations?

The Republican Party welcomed all racists from the old Democratic Party. Think back to that great Republican, Strom Thurman, who famously left the Dem's because they became too liberal, and, gasp, thought all races were equal. He proudly became a Republican because that party was more welcoming of the segregation philosophy.

And who can forget when good ol boy Trent Lott proudly proclaimed that he thought the rest of the nation was foolish for not voting for Strom back in 48 when he ran under a segregationist platform. Guess the Repubs aren't too far removed from that way of thinking now, are they?

And, yes, Republican wing nuts warmly welcomed David Duke during his unsuccessful run at the Senate a few years back. Embrace your party of elite white men!

[ccbatson]

One ancient relic, no current neanderthals of that mind set on the right. Loads of them on the left.

[rb336]

One ancient relic, no current neanderthals of that mind set on the right. Loads of them on the left.


are you serious? good god man, get some help to return to reality

[rb336]

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,399921,00.html

I seriously doubt, with George Allen's macaca comment in the 06 senate race and numerous other examples, that much has changed in the 6 years since that article was written

[ccbatson]

Check the guy right behind Obama who called him a new, clean, and articulate black politician. Nahh, that isn't racist, is it?

[ccbatson]

Guess who I am referring to? Joe, never buy a used car from this man, Biden.

[Detroitej72]

I doubt Biden would have a car to sell you, he rides the train!

[rb336]

Check the guy right behind Obama who called him a new, clean, and articulate black politician. Nahh, that isn't racist, is it?

he called him articulate, but didn't call him black

[Detroitej72]

You are taking one off-the-cuff comment out of context and then trying to paint someone as a racist while ignoring their entire life's work that shows that they are not.

That is the strategy of the right, take out of context, distort, and play to people's fears. This is why the Republican Party is in serious trouble, they are loosing the moderate wing and the fringe radical right is bunkering down for a cultural revolution.

[ccbatson]

Serious trouble? One mid term lame duck ousting election with a Rino running for the GOP?

What do you libs think racism means?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/racism

Biden considering Obama an positive exception to the rest of the race is extremely racist.

[jams]

Google response:
Your search - "a new, clean, and articulate black politician.", Joe Biden - did not match any documents

[Detroitej72]

Well said, Jaber...But you have to understand, the said "Party of Lincoln" is far from what Lincoln stood for, and is currently a party of the "last angry white male", clinging to power, and is scrambling for all who pay the least bit attention to it's racist platform.

[ccbatson]

Sorry...two moderate losses in lame duck administrations. Check history and watch what Obama will usher in for 2010 and 2012 (G-d willing).

[Lorax]

The GOP is nothing more than a largely southern, white male party who's influence was on the wane even in the 90's, with the stolen election of 2000 as their last grasp at holding power, and unfortunately for us, resulted in 8 years of the systematic destruction of our society.

Tush and Cheney ruled from the hard right fascist wing of the party, tossing out moderates like Colin Powell, and began their reign of terror promising to rule from the middle, knowing they stole the election, but figured they had nothing to lose by doing so, since it was all about them, their lust for oil money and, of course, raiding the national treasury on the way out the door. All planned beautifully.

[ccbatson]

Check back after the 2010 and 2012 elections regarding who you think does, or does not, comprise conservatives in America.

[Lorax]

Happily I will. Will be great seeing additional losses on the fascist right.

I hope Saracuda Failin' runs again, perhaps she and Brush Lintball can team up, we can label them the Hockey Marm and the Caftan Warlord. :eek:

[ccbatson]

No, they don't have a fillibuster proof majority (which, trust me, you should thank G-d they don't). Let's revisit your predictions when the time comes Jaberwocky. Even you will be singing a different tune as the progressive worsening and painful damage is done by Obama.

[Lorax]

One ancient relic, no current neanderthals of that mind set on the right. Loads of them on the left.

Ancient relic?

Are we referring to your ideas, or your wardrobe? Both? :eek:

Neanderthals, now that's an interesting one to run with....

Repugnican Knuckledraggers aka Neanderthalis Modernistas:

Knute GinGrinch
Saracuda Failin'
Michael Steele
Glenda Speck
Brush Lintball
Sean Manatee
Mann Coultergeist
Bill Kristolmeth
Richard Piggery
John Boner
Jeff N. Sessions (the 'N' stands for Needsafew)
ScEric Cantor
Bill Orally

Why are all of these people so utterly awful?

You guys must be longing for Nixon right about now.:eek:

[Detroitej72]

You guys must be longing for Nixon right about now.:eek:

Actually, the current crop of goons make Nixon look tame, almost saintlike by comparison.

[Lorax]

Actually, the current crop of goons make Nixon look tame, almost saintlike by comparison.

My point exactly!:eek:

[Danny]

Rush Linbaugh is still probably angry from the last year election when his old friend Dick Cheney and Joe Six Pack lose that is taking out of the Neo-Cons. That really fuel the downfall of the Republican Party leading to the rise of Democratic Socialist Party in the United States.

[rb336]

Uh yes. The Democratic Party proudly brought you slavery, the KKK, Jim Crow, Lynchings, Segregation etc. etc. etc.

Meanwhile Republicans brought you freedom, prosperity and worked on equality for all..

and then, after the last REAL republican (TR) the two parties switched (except in the south, where they are always slow to change)

[ccbatson]

I am really starting to like this FreeofAletall guy.

[ccbatson]

Jaberwocky is it now? Crawled out of your hole for a moment did you?

[ccbatson]

I am...are you?

[ccbatson]

Ignorance is bliss...while it lasts....enjoy.

[Lorax]

Returning to the title of this thread, I feel we need to take a deep breath and enjoy the beauty of Limbaugh being called a Nazi.

There is such purity and beauty in seeing the brilliant truth. :D

[ccbatson]

Yet you still try, don't you Jaberwocky? It isn't a matter of a lack of desire, it is a matter of lack of ability on your part.

[Lorax]

I am really starting to like this FreeofAletall guy.

Perhaps you two can get your picture taken together.;)

[Lorax]

Uh yes. The Democratic Party proudly brought you slavery, the KKK, Jim Crow, Lynchings, Segregation etc. etc. etc.

Meanwhile Republicans brought you freedom, prosperity and worked on equality for all.

It wasn't until democrats figured out they could not win anymore that they, the Socialists and communists(i.e. Liberals) all joined forces to overthrow the good republicans have been doing in this country since the inception of the party.

It was a smart coup actually. All they did was beat republicans to the punch by a small margin.

Now with the propaganda wing (i.e. media,and educators,) of their party working overtime in the brainwashing dept. they have managed to project onto republicans the very essence of their own vicious historical being via mass media lies. (i.e. Pravda American style. Mathews,Olberman,Maddow,Sanchez,Sharpton,Jackson,e tc.)


Communism might just win after all. But how long do you think it will last before people tire of your stomping all over their rights? Especially the 1st amendment.

LOL!!!

Really? Funny how it was Democrats who fought for and ended slavery, the 19th amendment which gave women the right to vote, achieved the voting rights act in 1965, brought us the New Deal, the WPA, the CCC, the Great Society, Social Security, Medicare, and all related reforms which have only added to our progress as a society.

And Repugnicans fought us all the way.

And the Repugnican presidents in power at the time were forced through popular Democratic majorities to sign some of this legislation into law!

How sweet is that irony? :D

[ccbatson]

Which Democrats? Lincoln? Frederick Douglas? MLK? Forget the party label...conservatives to a person.

[rb336]

Which Democrats? Lincoln? Frederick Douglas? MLK? Forget the party label...conservatives to a person.


definitively NOT conservatives by any known definition of the term

[Detroitej72]

Which Democrats? Lincoln? Frederick Douglas? MLK? Forget the party label...conservatives to a person.

All of the above mentioned were pretty liberal. Hell, our wonderful FBI thought MLK was such a dangerous liberal that they had quite the file on him.

John W. Booth was a conservative, and quite angry with that damn liberal Lincoln, and we know what happened there. James Earl Ray was also very much a conservative, and again, look what his actions were.

Hell, if there was talk radio back then, the ditto heads of the day would have been calling for Lincoln to fail.

[gibran]

I never used to be this way. But you get really frustrated and angry after hearing people use the same tired talking points to rip on every single aspect of anyone with philosophical differences. "That guys a conservative, that means he's a bigot and wants everyone to suffer." No conservative can do a single good deed in the minds of all these countless people, who cannot bring themselves to open their minds and admit that their political opposites are not the otherworldy monsters they make themselves to be. Im angry because I live in severley polarized country where too many people think its impossible that any good can come from someone elses side. Im getting angry because people are putting party affiliation before anything else and are blindly loyal to a party that is more flawed than they like to think. Im getting angry because we can't put political signs on our private property without narrow-minded loyalists stealing or even burning them. Im pissed that I had a political bumper sticker on my car supporting the Republican candidate and someone walked onto my private property and pulled it off my personal vehicle in the middle of the night, and far too many people of their mindset publicly condone this. I do not know even one person who tampered with anyones property containing an advertisement for a Democratic candidate. I hear story after story of conservatives being publicly reviled and harrassed, but never liberals or conservatives being harrassed in the same vein.If I sound angry, its because Im tired of the blatant disregard people have for anyone whos views dont fit within their personal narrow mindset and refuse to listen to opposing viewpoints with calm, friendly dialogue, or without violating personal privacy or private property rights.

I had my bumper sticker riped off from my car in my front yard...who was the candidate's sticker? None other than Barak...and while riping off my bumper sticker was mild...the continous "riping" off Obama lawn signs was an invasionof property rights...isn't that usually a right wing issue (property rights?).

[ccbatson]

Con*serv"a*tive\, n. 1. One who, or that which, preserves from ruin, injury, innovation, or radical change; a preserver; a conserver.

With the subject of the action to be conserved being liberty.

Make more sense now?

[Lorax]

Con*serv"a*tive\, n. 1. One who, or that which, preserves from ruin, injury, innovation, or radical change; a preserver; a conserver.

With the subject of the action to be conserved being liberty.

Make more sense now?

No, not really. :eek:

[Lorax]

All of the above mentioned were pretty liberal. Hell, our wonderful FBI thought MLK was such a dangerous liberal that they had quite the file on him.

John W. Booth was a conservative, and quite angry with that damn liberal Lincoln, and we know what happened there. James Earl Ray was also very much a conservative, and again, look what his actions were.

Hell, if there was talk radio back then, the ditto heads of the day would have been calling for Lincoln to fail.

Or labeled James Earl Ray a liberal.

[jams]

Con*serv"a*tive\, n. 1. One who, or that which, preserves from ruin, injury, innovation, or radical change; a preserver; a conserver.


I'm still waiting for my copy of The Official, but unpublished, Glossary of Batsonia, until then, I'm forced to use standard dictionaries of the English language for definitions.

[rb336]

Con*serv"a*tive\, n. 1. One who, or that which, preserves from ruin, injury, innovation, or radical change; a preserver; a conserver.

With the subject of the action to be conserved being liberty.

Make more sense now?


funny. conservatives have always been at the fore in the fight against expanding liberties to those who don't have them. any examination of history will show that to even the most feeble-minded.

conservative are dedicated to maintaining the status quo, in this case, the priveledge of the economic elites and the ultimate demotion of labor and the middle class to that of drones and indentured servants

[rb336]

From Merriam-Webster:

conservative

4 entries found.

<LI selected="selected">1conservative (adjective) (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/conservative[1])
2conservative (noun) (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/conservative[2])
Conservative Judaism (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/Conservative%20Judaism)
Progressive Conservative (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/Progressive%20Conservative)





Main Entry: 1con·ser·va·tive http://www.merriam-webster.com/images/audio.gif (http://www.merriam-webster.com/cgi-bin/audio.pl?conser06.wav=conservative') Pronunciation: \kən-ˈsər-və-tiv\ Function: adjective Date: 14th century 1: preservative (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/preservative)2 a: of or relating to a philosophy of conservatism (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/conservatism) bcapitalized : of or constituting a political party professing the principles of conservatism: as (1): of or constituting a party of the United Kingdom advocating support of established institutions (2): progressive conservative (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/progressive+conservative) 3 a: tending or disposed to maintain existing views, conditions, or institutions : traditional (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/traditional) b: marked by moderation or caution <a conservative estimate> c: marked by or relating to traditional norms of taste, elegance, style, or manners 4: of, relating to, or practicing Conservative Judaism
— con·ser·va·tive·ly adverb
— con·ser·va·tive·ness noun

conservatism

One entry found.




Main Entry: con·ser·va·tism http://www.merriam-webster.com/images/audio.gif (http://www.merriam-webster.com/cgi-bin/audio.pl?conser05.wav=conservatism') Pronunciation: \kən-ˈsər-və-ˌti-zəm\ Function: noun Date: 1832 1capitalized a: the principles and policies of a Conservative party b: the Conservative party2 a: disposition in politics to preserve what is established b: a political philosophy based on tradition and social stability, stressing established institutions, and preferring gradual development to abrupt change ; specifically : such a philosophy calling for lower taxes, limited government regulation of business and investing, a strong national defense, and individual financial responsibility for personal needs (as retirement income or health-care coverage)3: the tendency to prefer an existing or traditional situation to change

[Omaha]

Hey, I just read Cc’s posts #142 an #146. He is claiming that three historical figures, whom I consider liberal, are really conservative! Holy cow! I think the great man is wrong…for the first time maybe. :confused:

To his credit, let me admit that life is complicated and so are people. No one is all one thing or another. But with the three he cites…I think he is twisting reality to make it fit into his worldview.

I believe he mistakenly labels Abraham Lincoln, Frederick Douglass, and Martin Luther King, Jr. as political conservatives (in the way we now think of the word). But I could be wrong, maybe he was thinking of another Lincoln, another Douglass (or maybe there is some great conservative with the last name Douglas), and another MLK (possibly MLK, Jr.’s father before he had a son named after him)?

Please indulge me as I try to explain that to call these folks conservative, as I proudly use the word when I refer to myself as a Colbert Conservative, is a misuse of that proud term.

Abraham Lincoln was a great lover of the personal liberty. But it was the liberty of the slave and the average working man who he dearly cherished. Let me illustrate that with a few quotes:

“To secure to each laborer the whole product of his labor, or as nearly as possible, is a most worthy object of any good government.” (1847) Illinois Congressman Abraham Lincoln, later to become 16th President of the United States

“Labor is prior to and independent of capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much higher consideration.” Abraham Lincoln, 16th President of the United States in his first message to Congress, December 3, 1861

As I read both quotes, Lincoln is implying that the government needs to side with labor against owners. And he is being consistent over time, implying that this was a core value of his! BTW his analysis of labor and capital in the second quote is pretty standard for the day. Adam Smith wrote something similar, but without the interpretation. Taken together, they imply that labor creates all wealth. Luckily for us Social Darwinists that capital has enough control of government that that kind of SOCIALISM hasn’t come to pass yet. .:D

“Labour was the first price, the original purchase - money that was paid for all things. It was not by gold or by silver, but by labour, that all wealth of the world was originally purchased.” Adam Smith, Scottish political economist and author of The Wealth of Nations

Then there is Frederick Douglass: BTW it is Frederick Douglass (not Frederick Douglas). Here’s a Douglass quote showing is love of liberty.

“I prayed for freedom for twenty years, but received no answer until I prayed with my legs.” Frederick Douglass former slave, American abolitionist, editor, orator, author, statesman and reformer.

Now by running away he was depriving his Master of his property, and, if caught, would be sent back under Federal law (Section 2, Clause 3 of the Constitution)…but he was preserving his freedom and at the same time depriving his Master of the liberty and freedom to unilaterally make decisions about Mr. Douglass’ quality of life as a slave.

Along the same theme of aiding the poor, the downtrodden, the little person here is Douglass commenting on what seems to be labor unions. I am on the other side of this kind of crazy talk. After all, Douglass is being consistent with the idea that “labor creates all wealth” and therefore is deserving of its “fair share” of the wealth it creates. That is an anathema to me as a Colbert Conservative.

“It is a great mistake for any class of laborers to isolate itself and thus weaken the bond of brotherhood between those on whom the burdens and hardship of labor (fall). The fortunate ones of the Earth, who are abundant in land and money and know nothing of the anxious care and pinching poverty of the laboring classes, may be indifferent to the appeal to justice at this point, but the laboring classes cannot afford to be indifferent. What labor everywhere wants, what it ought to have, and will someday demand and receive, is an honest day's pay for an honest day's work. As the laborer becomes more intelligent he will develop what capital he already possesses --that is the power to organize and combine for its own protection.” Frederick Douglass, American Abolitionist, Orator, Labor Leader, and Statesman

Which brings us to Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. Again with the quotes:

“As I have said many times, and believe with all my heart, the coalition that can have the greatest impact in the struggle for human dignity here in America is that of the Negro and the forces of labor, because their fortunes are so closely intertwined.” Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. in a letter to the Amalgamated Laundry Workers, January 1962.

“The labor movement was the principal force that transformed misery and despair into hope and progress. Out of its bold struggles, economic and social reform gave birth to unemployment insurance, old age pensions, government relief for the destitute and above all new wage levels that meant not mere survival, but a tolerable life. The captains of industry did not lead this transformation; they resisted it until they were overcome.” Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. 1965

Judging by his words, Dr. King was a great lover of freedom and liberty. But whose? Now maybe Dr. King was saying that unions are not collectivist; and that they don’t use their collective power to redistribute wealth away from owners and to workers. Maybe he didn’t also sign onto the philosophy that “labor creates all wealth,” and therefore it’s only just that owners are forced to share it. Maybe he didn’t see the liberty and freedom of Negroes and employees as pushing up against the liberty and freedom of owners and a white-dominated class structure…but I think he did. So in my book Dr. King, like Lincoln and Douglass, was a liberal!

It’s just that, as with these other liberals, their assertion of liberty and freedom comes smack up against the property rights of others…the rich, the well-born, and the powerful. As a Social Darwinist, I am against this kind of “power to the people” philosophy espoused by the three people Cc mentions. I don’t know but maybe if Cc can’t see this liberalism, maybe I will have to reconsider my deep and abiding devotion to the Oracle of Conservatism on DY. Maybe I won’t be so awed by his many pearls of wisdom. :rolleyes:

But I hope I am wrong, and he will give a detailed treatise on how I misinterpreted these men as liberals…but, alas, I doubt it.

[Lorax]

Omaha, what seems lost on you is that there is a reason the labor movement took off, and a reason why we've needed unionization.

Corporations left to their own devices have proven themselves time and time again to be unable to resist screwing their own workers.

Why do you think so many American corporations close shop and move to countries where no labor laws exist?

They have consistently proven themselves unfit to employ people in large numbers.

[ccbatson]

Lincoln was a Republican, as was Douglas. All were staunch advocates for the dignity and sanctity of individual liberty in opposition to slavery and oppression based on race/racism.

From this perspective, you don't get any more conservative...and thank G-d that they were.

Today's American liberals are collectivist and statist, falsely claiming that the good of the many outweighs the good of the one. Redistributing wealth, fomenting class envy, anti capitalistic, anti liberty agendas as best illustrated to our current President (and Stalin/Castro/Chavez...who recently described Obama as more liberal then Castro and himself).

[Omaha]

I am so disappointed and shocked that THE conservative Oracle of DY, while writing more than just one sentence, wasn’t capable of responding to my detailed post (#152) other than with rhetoric…rhetoric not based in reality but with words that mirror his apparently distorted misunderstanding of how the real world works. :mad:

While undeniably prolific, Cc appears incapable of adequately analyzing data. I laid out clearly LIBERAL positions of Lincoln and Douglass and he ignored them and repeated his mistaken belief that they are CONSERVATIVES. I couldn’t believe it. Cc ignores their defense of depriving owners of their property rights and blindly categorizes them as conservatives. I thought him an educated well-informed conservative. Now I am beginning to believe he just likes parroting words…over and over again ad nauseum. :(

Life is complicated. Historically there have been conservative Democrats (Bourbon Democrats and Dixiecrats) and Liberal Republicans like Lincoln and Douglass. I try not to make blanket statements, but when I do and someone has the kindness to point out my inconsistency…I hope that I don’t react as Cc did and deny the obvious.

Cc is right about one thing. Lincoln and Douglass (he even misspelled the name AGAIN after I clearly and kindly gave him the correct spelling in my post) indeed loved individual liberty…the liberty of the poor and downtrodden to get what they felt was their share of the “wealth they had helped create.” In their statements (as I laid out in #152) and their actions, they promoted the rights of the poor and powerless over the property rights of the rich and well-born. Let me repeat Lincoln and Douglass advocated limiting the liberty and rights of private property! :mad: That kind of “people before profits” is a LIBERAL stance and NOT conservative. It is similar to those leaders he listed at the end of his post.

Then as if running away from his post #142 he refused to even acknowledge my quotes and proved that Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. was a liberal and not a conservative. I am beginning to think that Cc is so caught up in repeating and writing his distorted version of the conservative mantra that he can’t see reality. I'm just glad that his views don’t limit his ability to earn a living. Nevertheless, I know that my disillusionment with his betrayal of a rigorous and factual defense of conservatism will not register and bounce off him. Alas, more's the pity.

While it pains me deeply, I guess I will just have to attempt to ignore Cc when he criticizes or labels me in the future. I hope that DY has others who can join me in adequately defending the world views of Colbert Conservatives and Social Darwinists like myself. :D

[Lorax]

I just love how so-called conservatives have adopted (i.e. shape shifting again) the term "social darwinism" since they don't believe in evolution, and prefer to inhabit the delusional world of talking snakes and virgin births.

As well, Omaha, you refuse to answer my previous post which in a few sentences negates your lenghty screed on the need for an organized society.

I guess if we lived in a jungle, social darwinsim would have it's place, but I would prefer governmnetal checks and balances on the activities of corporations. It's silly to expect that there is any hope we're going back to the era of robber barons and the Triangle Factory fires of a long ago fascist social regime.

We as liberals have fought and won the social/cultural wars, and we're not giving them back.

If you had your way, corporations would rule the nation, women wouldn't have the right to vote, and slavery would be the best and cheapest form of labor.

And what's with this "colbert conservative" nonsense?

I guess it's better for you guys to worship a comedian than a real fascist, so have at it!

[Pam]

And what's with this "colbert conservative" nonsense?

I guess it's better for you guys to worship a comedian than a real fascist, so have at it!

It's pretty self explanatory, yet still there are those who don't get it. Amazing.

[Lorax]

It's pretty self explanatory, yet still there are those who don't get it. Amazing.


Thrill me with your acumen......

[Pam]

Thrill me with your acumen......

Colbert is a fake conservative so someone calling themselves a "Colbert Conservative" is also fake.

[Lorax]

Colbert is a fake conservative so someone calling themselves a "Colbert Conservative" is also fake.

Fantastic! You passed with flying colors.

I knew that!

But today, with up being down, black being white, right being right-on, I was having my doubts!

[jams]

Damn, Omaha,you've been outed.

Although,please continue, the laughs I get from your posts and the reactions from both sides alone are worth far more than the price of admission.

[ccbatson]

Sorry Omaha, here are the answers you were looking for:

Wrong on Lincoln...labor is the allegory of productivity and renders capital irrelevant. This is the only possible definition given the sanctity of individual liberty at the core of his beliefs.

Wrong on Douglass as well...no individual human can ever be property as this is antithetical to the concept of individual liberty. This is what he was fighting against (rightfully so). Opposing an unconstitutional seizure of individual liberty in the form of slavery cannot be equated to depriving someone of their rightful property (ie a slave).

Wrong on MLK also as he was combatting the illegal and unfair seizure of individual property from Blacks by...whomever (everyone at the time). He was using organized labor as a tool to accomplish this goal. Once this was complete (after his untimely death), the union's primary role is dissolved, and so to should have been the unions themselves. What occurred instead is that organized labor, without a legitimate purpose, became the collectivist monstrosity that it is today. Ideally, the rule of law, and not unions, would have stepped up and asserted itself to arbitrate for just contractual relations between all individuals (and groups of individuals). Since it failed to do so, MLK rebelled via the tools described above. Once rule of law was properly and constitutionally re-established, the temporary vehicles used during this "rebellion" should have dissolved (but didn't).

Damn...I am good.

[Lorax]

Sorry Omaha, here are the answers you were looking for:

Wrong on Lincoln...labor is the allegory of productivity and renders capital irrelevant. This is the only possible definition given the sanctity of individual liberty at the core of his beliefs.

Wrong on Douglass as well...no individual human can ever be property as this is antithetical to the concept of individual liberty. This is what he was fighting against (rightfully so). Opposing an unconstitutional seizure of individual liberty in the form of slavery cannot be equated to depriving someone of their rightful property (ie a slave).

Wrong on MLK also as he was combatting the illegal and unfair seizure of individual property from Blacks by...whomever (everyone at the time). He was using organized labor as a tool to accomplish this goal. Once this was complete (after his untimely death), the union's primary role is dissolved, and so to should have been the unions themselves. What occurred instead is that organized labor, without a legitimate purpose, became the collectivist monstrosity that it is today. Ideally, the rule of law, and not unions, would have stepped up and asserted itself to arbitrate for just contractual relations between all individuals (and groups of individuals). Since it failed to do so, MLK rebelled via the tools described above. Once rule of law was properly and constitutionally re-established, the temporary vehicles used during this "rebellion" should have dissolved (but didn't).

Damn...I am good.

For what?

I didn't see anything you've written so far that passed the smell test. :eek:

[Omaha]

My worst fears have been realized. Cc has revealed why he doesn’t engage in longer posts. :( In post #162 he displays that he lives in a self-constructed alternative reality that only exists in his head. He again avers, for all who will read, that Abraham Lincoln, Frederick Douglass, and Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. were conservatives and NOT liberals. Poppycock!

In his alternative world: white is black; up is down, good is bad, liberal is conservative and the Wings won last night’s game thereby winning back to back Stanley Cups. (Oh, I wish that they had!) In my world, liberals like Lincoln, Douglass, and King are an anathema to Colbert Conservatives and Social Darwinists everywhere. :rolleyes:


I gave this Lincoln quote as proof of Abe’s liberalism:

“Labor is prior to and independent of capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much higher consideration.”

But Cc informs me that I misunderstood Lincoln’s quote because “labor is an allegory” for productivity…blah, blah, blah. Here’s my guess about how he’d interpret the part where Lincoln clearly says labor is superior to capital and deserves much higher consideration than capital. Cc would argue that Lincoln’s clear wording was really a fairy tale wrapped in an enigma, surrounded by a parable, enveloped by a metaphor that can only be decoded by Cc and his delusional rantings. My worst fears have indeed been realized: Cc is in his own fantasy alternative world.

After the enactment of the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments, Douglass (Cc finally spelled his name correctly after my promptings) became the head of the National Negro Labor Union. Why? Two reasons: for the great majority of the time blacks were not allowed in white unions and secondly he understood that “uniting as one” limited an employer’s chance to engage in a reverse auction and drive down wages. “What labor everywhere wants, what it ought to have, and will someday demand and receive, is an honest day's pay for an honest day's work. As the laborer becomes more intelligent he will develop what capital he already possesses --that is the power to organize and combine for its own protection.”

Again Douglass was a liberal. Heck he was at Seneca Falls in 1848 and united with another group of disenfranchised people…white women.

In his alternative world, Cc is able to see into the future and claim that Dr. King would have abandoned organized labor at some undetermined point after his untimely assassination. The former conservative Oracle of DY goes on to imply that organized labor may have served a useful purpose then, but it has become a collectivist monstrosity today. Gee, I am glad that Cc has such a grip on reality: organized labor when it had 25-30% density was OK, and now that it is 12% it’s a collectivist monstrosity. King was a liberal. Most unions are liberal. Birds of a feather, flock together.

Alas, in Cc’s alternative universe white is black; up is down, good is bad, liberal is conservative and the Wings won last night’s game. :(

[vetalalumni]

ccbatson, you are (rhetorically) done and done. It is almost not even fun anymore.

[Lorax]

The FBI has a file on every person ion this country that has somewhat of a footprint. Even you.

The FBI was interested in MLK because he forged allegiance with the communist party . Thats why they were interested in him.

Not only is your ideology bankrupt, you're also naive.

MLK was viewed as a political enemy, since his influence was growing exponentially over time. The FBI creates dossiers on anyone the sitting president wishes, and at that time with the direct influence of the cross-dressing, shape-shifting right wing fascist J. Edgar Hoover.

His murder was a snuff job ordered by the right wing. Better a martyr in their minds than a living agitator.

[ccbatson]

Omaha...you realize that you strengthened my arguments on balance, and offered no rational refuting arguments to my logic, don't you?

Are you being sarcastic again?