Charlie LeDuff borrows a story

[Cooper]

Charlie LeDuff kicked off a new weekly series today in the Detroit News ("Travels with Charlie") with a feature on Glemie Dean Beasley, the "Coon Man."

http://www.detnews.com/article/20090402/METRO08/904020395/To+urban+hunter++next+meal+is+scampering+by

Hm. I wonder where he got the idea ...

http://metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=13618

[rjk]

When you're looking for a stories a guy selling coons does stand out.
It is possible to come across something like this and not know that it was done by the Metrotimes.

I wonder if CL has even heard of the MT. If I didn't see it piled up 6" high when I walked into a coney island I wouldn't know about it either. Let's not act like it has a large readership.

Even if he did get the story from the MT it enabled this coon guys story to go from A ball to the major leagues.

[oldredfordette]

Maybe he could walk from one end of Outer Drive to the other. That hasn't been done in about two years. The story will practically write itself! :D

[Lowell]

CBC did a story on the blues playing coon merchant two nights ago when they had blogger John on. No doubt he led them to him. BTW he is great guitarist.

My neighbor in Highland Park raised coons on occasion. It is an old south thing. Trouble was his kept escaping on him making work for HP's animal control [back when they still had services like that.]

"There's no news like old news."

[Bearinabox]

In a city this big and this weird, LeDuff should have no trouble finding oddities to write about. Looks like he decided to take a day off. Nice work if you can get it.

[Lonyo exit]

Rjk - So he's never heard of Metro Times, despite being written about in it and interviewed by them. Uh, ok brown noser.

[dexterferry]

where's realitycheck and gnome all the other LeDuff apologists?

it's not like this is the first time. remember that story he "discovered" "all by himself" driving around detroit---the one about the suburbanites moving the graves of their ancestors?

yeah, there was a full documentary movie made about than phenomenon in 2003 by someone else who "discovered" it. it was part of the Shrinking Cities exhibit a few years back. maybe that's where Charlie "discovered" it.

Give him a break guys, it's not easy finding all these great stories about Detroit when you have to commute from St. Clair Shores every day! And it's not like your brother calls with juicy tip before every deadline. . . sometimes you just need a little help!

[dexterferry]

"The interior paint has the faded sepia tones of an old man's teeth; the wallpaper is as flaky and dry as an old woman's hand."

I like how he has the cajones to write a sentence that terrible, but couldn't include a simple sentence like "I first read about him on the excellent Detroitblog and decided I had to meet him for myself. . ."

it's not that he's poaching ideas from other, more talented writers that's the real problem. it's that he's not crediting those he's poaching from and acting like he's discovering it all on his own. it's the whole Jayson Blair New York Times scummy journalism of half-truths and manufactured quotes that this guy is so steeped in. . . I honestly believe he doesn't know how to work any other way.

[boogiechillen]

Let's not forget that plagiarism is the reason LeDuff left the New York Times and is rebuilding his carreer at The News.

http://www.slate.com/id/2092708/

I do appreciate his writing abilities, but the man needs some original ideas. I will give him and Max Ortiz credit for producing excellent web shorts in which LeDuff is able to get local notables to speak quite candidly (Kevorkian's Nihilistic rant about wishing he had never been born, MonCon's reinactment of the Shrek incident). LeDuff is definitely a mixed bag.

[gravitymachine]

moderator, please cross-post to "crap journalism in the D"

[raptor56]

Is there a reporter who gets more mention and attention on DYES than Charlie LeDuff?

[Detroitnerd]

A friend joked today, "The latest from LeDuff was better when I read it in Metro Times back in January..." Made me laugh.

[dexterferry]

maybe in a few weeks Charlie can go to the Schvitz and report what happens on Couples Night.

[gnome]

I guess folks think that only one story can be written about something. Sure would put an end to ... let's see, hmm,... literature, music, movies, painting and everything else.

The best thing I liked about the video was the Coon Man's blues playing; what was the best thing about the video for you?

Oh, btw, LeDuff lives in Pleasant Ridge and as far as being an apologist, I'm fine with that. If you don't like his stuff, don't read it. Life is complicated enough, give yourself a break, you deserve it.

[Bearinabox]

I guess folks think that only one story can be written about something. Sure would put an end to ... let's see, hmm,... literature, music, movies, painting and everything else.
I would rather have LeDuff tell us about something else that's interesting in the city. I already knew about the raccoon guy. When LeDuff is "on," I enjoy his writing, but there are plenty of oddities in the city to go around, and I'd like to read about something I didn't already know existed. That's the appeal of Detroitblog for me--either he reports about something like the TV repair place on Chene that I've seen and wondered about but never been inside, or he reports on something like that guy in Brightmoor selling the remnants of dead people's estates out of an abandoned house that I would never have known about if not for him. LeDuff has the potential to do the same thing--Christ knows there's potential in a job where all you have to do is ride around town in a dark-red Checker cab and look for weirdness--but instead he chose to phone it in, and I have lost some respect for him as a result.


The best thing I liked about the video was the Coon Man's blues playing; what was the best thing about the video for you?I seem to remember a similar video (complete with blues playing) in the Detroitblog/Metro Times piece.


Oh, btw, LeDuff lives in Pleasant Ridge and as far as being an apologist, I'm fine with that.Thought it was somewhere up Woodward. I've seen him driving up and down in his Checker cab.

If you don't like his stuff, don't read it. Life is complicated enough, give yourself a break, you deserve it.I haven't formed a hard-and-fast opinion on his stuff yet. I've only really become aware of him in the past few months. I think he's a hell of a writer when he wants to be, and I think articles like this are evidence of laziness rather than incompetence. I would like to enjoy his writing, but if all he does is rehash Detroitblog, I'll take a pass.

[Lonyo exit]

He sure has a history of having a hard time coming up with original material:

http://www.sanfranmag.com/story/rolling-nowhere

[BShea]

I know Charlie knows what MT is, but I doubt he reads it weekly.

And more than one publication will do a story on some interesting subject.

Even if MT and some blog did it prior, a helluva lot more people read about it for the first time in The News today.

I know when I write something unique in Crain's, it's going to be seen only by something like 60,000 readers potentially, out of millions. So if some other pub writes about it, I'm not going to cry plagiarism.

Blogs and alt-weeklies have a pretty small cadre of readers in a market like this. I don't blame Charlie or any other reporter for not vetting what they write against the small players in the media game. And there's simply too many with all the blogs out there, too. Proliferation of news is good and bad, and there's going to be a lot of "repeating" of stories that isn't someone being lazy and cheating.

[Cooper]

I'm not bothered that he repeated the story. One of the benefits of smaller publications like the Metro Times and Crain's Detroit is that they draw attention to important, overlooked stories that the dailies or other media can then bring to a wider audience. I just wish he had cited his source.

Of course, I don't know for sure that he read or heard the story first through Detroitblogger John. Maybe he also saw the "Fresh Coons" signs and pursued the lead himself. But given his track record, it's hard to give him the benefit of the doubt. My hunch is that he wrote an original version of a story he first saw elsewhere and didn't bother to credit the source of his inspiration. If so, that's wrong.

By the way, BShea, do you think that most local journalists really don't bother reading the smaller publications like the Metro Times or Crain's Detroit? If so, that's a shame. Crain's reporting on Detroit is generally better than either daily, and the lag between the Metro Times and the dailies on major stories like the incinerator or the bridge is often measured in months, not hours or days. But if journalists don't bother to read their competitors, they won't even know they're being scooped!

[EastsideAl]

Oh c'mon. The Metro Times has been the major weekly in the Detroit area for, what, more than 25 years now? It breaks at least as many local stories as the Free Press and the News, and its editor is someone who was a lead entertainment writer for the Free Press for 15+ years and is extremely well known on the local newspaper and entertainment scene. It's at least the third most widely read publication in Detroit. And you mean to tell me seriously the LeDuff wouldn't know about it?

And DetroitBlog has been the major blog telling the stories of Detroit since basically the dawn of the blogging era, and is widely read and respected in this area and by those interested in our area. How do you think Detroitblog John got his Metro Times gig?

LeDuff wouldn't have even known about the raccoon guy, let alone have written about him, if it hadn't been for John's work. It truly strains credulity to believe or maintain otherwise. The fact that Charlie didn't deign to even give a credit line only adds insult to the injury.

[dexterferry]

gnome, your continued loyalty Leduff is admirable. I'm sure you are a great friend to those close to you, but in this case I think it's really time to acknowledge that there's a pattern here that doesn't reflect well on Leduff's integrity.

I'm not going to argue about his talent as a writer; I personally think Detroitblogger John is a far better writer, and for every reader who loves Leduff's brand of gonzo Albomesque schlock there's another one rolling their eyes. I will say that Leduff has made a career out of questionable behavior, from his early plagurism to his days with Jayson Blair in the New York Times affirmative action program (Leduff is part Indian---the ......... Tribe of Livonia, I believe) to the Roosevelt Warehouse incident discussed here ad nauseum and now this. it's a pattern man. if you can't see it you're deliberately not looking.

No one believes only one person has the right to write about a certain topic, but when you're making a second career as some hardboiled Kuraltian gonzo reporter swooping down from the suburbs into the dark, black city to write about all the cuckoos, at least acknowledge that you're not the first to discover the rare specimen you're writing about.

talented people steal other peoples' ideas all the time. unfortunately for Leduff, he's less talented than those he's stealing from. he added nothing to this story other than some really cringeworthy turns of phrase. and if we all just shrug our shoulders and say "oh well, let's give him the benefit of the doubt" that just plays right into his pattern of behavior.

[mauser]

if i was the guy who edited the original detroitblog video, i think id be really pissed off that Charlie straight up copied it.

how absolutely lame.

[BShea]

It breaks at least as many local stories as the Free Press and the News

:rolleyes:

I got my chuckle for the day on that one. Thanks.

[Lonyo exit]

LOL! Repeating a story is one thing. But this?

Metro Times: He hunts them himself at night, using dogs with such names as Undertaker and Gravedigger to chase them up a tree, where Beasley brings them down with a .22.

LeDuff: He procures the coons with the help of the hound dogs who chase the animal up a tree, where Beasley harvests them with a .22 caliber rifle.


There was no other way to express things like this? It just happens to be nearly identical?



That's lazy bordering on plagiarism..

[dexterferry]

"Travels With Charlie."

That's an insult to John Steinbeck's dog.

[Reality_Check]

no other way to express things like this? It just happens to be nearly identical? That's lazy bordering on plagiarism..Oh puh-leese, give us a break and don't embarrass yourself anymore, Lonyo.

Each writer accompanied CoonMan on a hunt, saw him and the hounds do essentially the same thing with the same firearm, and described it.

You could play this kind of gotcha game with reports on KK's trial testimony, State of the City speeches, presidential news conferences and other events covered by by more than one English-speaking journalist.

By your reasoning, to apply that word loosely, daily weather reports are "lazy bordering on plagiarism."

There, now I've done gone 'n confirmed my status as a LeDuff apologist. Whatever.

Look, I chose my screename back deliberately . . . though I'd never claim mine is the only true "reality" (doesn't exist), just that my perspective is reality as I see it. Same as all of us, obviously . . .

. . . but some statements seem (seem, not are) simply too wacked-out to rest unchallenged.

And here's another thing: I'm glad Bill Shea is a forumer and piped up here smartly. So go ahead log me as his partisan, too, DexterFerry. Damn fine company.

[RO_Resident]

Are the coons being raised for pets or meat?

[gnome]

Like I said, Dex, life is complicated. It is filled with a thousand distractions, urgencies, and requirements. You need to cleanse yourself of the terrible Charlie LeDuff burden. It is weighing down your soul.

If you don't like him, just stop reading. No more parsing sentences. No more having to augur meaning from dependent clauses and literary flourishes. Less pressure on the ol aorta. You'll be happier, and less prone to leaving this world with a frown on your face. And as far as calling me out for being some sycophant, so be it. I like reading his work, I like the way he crafts his stories and for the most part I like his OHenry touch. I also like Norman Rockwell, Sabretts, BumpyCake and my '72 Pinto. None of them are standouts in their categories but I like them. So sue me. Belittle me. Call me whatever you want. I think LeDuff adds needed journalistic color to a beige town. If you don't like him, fine. I understand people have different tastes and I don't hold your cretinistic sensibilities against you. That would be unkind.

[dexterferry]

wow gnome, you sure are condescending for someone with one foot up on the cracker barrel.

whether you "like" him is irrelevant. the issue is the growing pile of evidence impugning his integrity as a journalist.

[rjk]

Rjk - So he's never heard of Metro Times, despite being written about in it and interviewed by them. Uh, ok brown noser.

No, I stated that "I wonder" if he had ever heard of the MT. I think I've read it a few times so I had no idea he was interviewed by them.

It's funny how some of you are acting as if the MT is the equivalent of the Detroit Free Press in relationship to the Detroit News.

[oldredfordette]

rjk, get a grip. The Metro Times is very well known, is a prominent local paper, and if you've only read it once or twice, you should stretch yourself a bit.

Many good journalists have passed through there, including several members of this forum, and many good journalists remain.

Go ahead and love LeDuff. Goody for you.

[eastsidechris]

Vigotte's, on Harper and Kensington, occasionally advertises that "We sell coons" in their window. I've never been tempted to sample one, but my uncle--who is from Missouri--gave me the same advice that the guy in the article gives: make sure when you buy 'raccoon' that the paw is left on so that way you know for sure that it's coon meat you're eating. :)

[mauser]

im wondering what Stikine thinks of Charlies masterful appropriation of somebody elses work.

[Lonyo exit]

Turns out if he's not stealing from others, he's rewriting something he wrote about another coon guy years ago. I guess they're all the same, eh Charlie?

http://www.jossip.com/pulitzer-prize-winner-simon-leduff-plagiarizes-himself-20090402/

[cloud_wall]

I know when I write something unique in Crain's, it's going to be seen only by something like 60,000 readers potentially, out of millions. So if some other pub writes about it, I'm not going to cry plagiarism.

Bill says it best and he ought to know. LeDuff's past sins are well-documented. This does not compare. What you are all saying, apparently, is that this incredibly interesting character does not deserve to be the subject of more than one story. The fact that the details are same in each shows that the reporters did their jobs...Charlie's mention of a .22 caliber rifle is not some sinister sign that he's slipping into plagiarism. Who, what, when, where, why...they each covered their bases. I'm glad I got to hear about the story, and I wouldn't have if LeDuff hadn't written it.

[Gianni]

Each writer accompanied CoonMan on a hunt, saw him and the hounds do essentially the same thing with the same firearm, and described it.



There is nothing in either piece that says or suggests that the writer accompanied the Coon Man on a hunt. Plus immediately following the passage about the dogs that he lifted from the MT, LeDuff writes, "A true outdoorsman, Beasley refuses to disclose his hunting grounds." So obviously the writer did not go hunting with him unless he were blindfolded.

There is also at least one glaring inaccuracy in the LeDuff piece:

"A coyote was snared two years ago roaming the Federal Court House downtown."

That's not only wrong (the coyote was caught outside roaming the streets somewhere in the neighborhood of the Federal Courthouse), it is obviously wrong. Unless the coyote is a federal judge he is not getting inside that building without having a picture ID, going through a metal detector, and putting his briefcase through the X ray machine. So either LeDuff didn't bother to get it right, his editor was sleeping, or both.

I don't mind this kid of colorful writing when it is well done, but this is the kind of exaggeration that crosses the line. He gives the impression that there are tumbleweeds in the Courthouse. It's usuaully quiet in there, but not that quiet.

And there is no way LeDuff does not know about the MT, which wrote cover story about his lazy journalism in the widely reported story about the homeless guy frozen in ice.

[Det_ard]

I eagerly await the shitstorm that'll happen when LeDuff writes about Tyree Guyton someday. How dare he?

The MT occasionally has some good stuff but it's still the baby brother to the two dailies in terms of news coverage, breaking stories and circulation. I'd bet real money that a majority of Tri-County residents have never even heard of it. It's a fringe/niche paper.

[BShea]

It's an alt-weekly. It's not the same thing as the Freep/News. It's not a daily newspaper. It's not a "traditional" news-gathering operation. Instead, it's like the alt-weeklies you see in other cities. It fills a niche readership market and role, and does some good work.

Some would argue these pubs are the weekly rag of the jaded hipster crowd that tries to be what it thinks is edgy, and others would say it does very necessary journalism that others don't do.

I'm all for voices to cater to all readership desires. But MT, Real Detroit and publications of that nature are not general circulation newspapers so its unfair to both to compare 'em in a general sense. They also don't have the financial and manpower resources of a corporate-owned newspaper. They print 100,000 copies, or whatever it is, but The News still have 140,000 people that pay to have it delivered (on the days they can still get it delivered!).

I also think the suggestion that they break as many stories as The News is absurd.

Anyway, there's a needed place for all these papers. (Especially Crain's, which serves yet another audience ... yeah, self shout-out there, so sue me!)

[thefishwrap]

I work for a weekly newspaper chain. I can't even begin to count the number of stories (general news or unique features like the coon guy) that I have written and then the "big" papers later reported. It's how it works. By extension, TV generally follows the freep/detnews.

[Patrick]

So is Charlie LeDuff a hillbilly? He sure sounds like one in that video or is it a put on?

[dexterferry]

leduff speaks in an affected accent; he's one of those white guys that talks differently around black people. he thinks he's "connecting" with them but really he just looks like an idot.

[Reality_Check]

There is nothing in either piece that says or suggests that the writer accompanied the Coon Man on a hunt. . . . Beasley refuses to disclose his hunting grounds." So obviously the writer did not go hunting with him."I respectfully disagree, Gianni.

The extent and precision of details in each separately reported article indicate to me that the reporters saw what they describe. These do not read like as-told-to features.

As for the "true outdoorsman" keeping mum about where he hunts, I took that to mean he asked Charlie not to disclose where they went. Yes, it could have been written more clearly ("Beasley asked a reporter not to disclose his hunting grounds"), though that would have interrupted narrative flow and present-tense style . . . and opened the writer to shots here -- again -- about putting himself into the strory.

I get that Charlie's approach is polarizing, and agree with Gnome this fits into the category of tastes and opinions -- not who's "wrong" or "right."

I also value this reality check from Cloud Wall:
The fact that the details are same in each shows that the reporters did their jobs...Charlie's mention of a .22 caliber rifle is not some sinister sign that he's slipping into plagiarism. Who, what, when, where, why...they each covered their bases.
Amen to that, bro'.

[mauser]

Heres the original 'house of blues' video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pclSdUpWXIY

[Stikine]

im wondering what Stikine thinks of Charlies masterful appropriation of somebody elses work.


Oh Mauser,....Silly Mauser,....many people can write about the same topic. Only you and yours think it is an appropriation of someone else's work. Give it a rest already! You do not like his work,...do not read it. For the rest of us who can appreciate good writing, interesting topics, and someone new writing about things old, I say write on! LeDuff,.....keep it coming Finley,....make me like sports Albom,....Blog on Oneita!

I do so miss my morning paper! And I am not quite into reading a newspaper online,....maybe in the summer when I have more time to idle away the hours. Still,...miss the newsprint on my hands!

[mauser]

Only you and yours

me and my what now ?

So Stikine - you see no similarity in the two pieces, and the two videos ? Yes / No ?

[pffft]

Memo to all: There are still print Detroit papers. You can get ink on your hands every day, you just have to go out and buy them Monday through Wednesday. Thrown on your porch Thursday-Sunday, or you can continue to go out and buy them...

p.s. "Oneita?" You cannot be serious...

[Lonyo exit]

I like how Stinkine puts Albom and LeDuff in the same sentence, two writers who don't let facts get in the way of a good yarn. Apt grouping.

[dexterferry]

I think everyone repeating the theme "more than one journalist can write about a person" just doesn't get it.

No one is saying coonman was off limits to Leduff because MT already had a story on him. But when another media outlet in your town writes an in-depth profile on a "local character" and then a bigger outlet sends out their "local color" guy to do an in-depth story on the same character, it seems the DECENT THING TO DO would be acknowledge the first one or make the second one different enough to justify its ink. In this case, the story (and the videos) are shockingly similar and the first story wasn't acknowledged.

No one is saying LeDuff violated anyone's intellectual property. We're saying that poaching a story is a pretty lousy thing to do. Sure the gnome and the bshea's will say it happens all the time. So? That doesn't make it right, and I think it speaks volumes about LeDuff's character. And LeDuff's character is pretty much defined by climbing on top of whoever gets in the way to put Charlie LeDuff above everyone else. With his checkered past, no matter how much "color" he's bringing to a "beige" scene, this incident just further proves that LeDuff is a real jerk.

Why does that matter? Some of us still believe in an old-style journalism where egos are put in check and facts are important. Charlie's LeDuff's "journalism" is just sensationalist egotism. I think the local reaction to LeDuff would be different if he hadn't strolled into town extolling his NYT credentials acting like he was blessing us rust belt peons with his mere presence. A little respect for those who have been toiling here for years would have gone a long way for Charlie LeDuff.

He can drive around in his stupid red cab pretending to look for stories while he lazily steals them from writers (and filmmakers: see the "Moving Graves" documentary) who've been covering detroit's odd stories for many years, but there are people who will continue to call him out on his lack of integrity and respect.

[Vic_doucette]

Amen, Dexterferry!

[pffft]

OK, but you'd better research it and make sure the M. Times was the first outlet ever, in all mankind, to write about the raccoon hunter. Are you certain?

With most stories, the provenance is very hard to prove. Reporters love to claim ownership of a story, but you can usually trace it back to someone else.

[Stikine]

Memo to all: There are still print Detroit papers. You can get ink on your hands every day, you just have to go out and buy them Monday through Wednesday. Thrown on your porch Thursday-Sunday, or you can continue to go out and buy them...

p.s. "Oneita?" You cannot be serious...


I am not saying that she is a great writer,...I just like her O Street. Reminds me of things I have forgotten, or clues me in to her thinking, I dunno,....I do not spend a lot of time on the internet but cannot really grasp reading the paper online. You are right about the paper being available ont he off delivery days. It was just so convenient having it delivered. I will make it a point to pick up a paper.

Since I am a blog-virgin, are there any out there worth checking out on a daily/weekly basis?

Mauser - we will never agree on the LeDuff front but surely there is some common ground somewhere?

[mauser]

Stikine - I am not at war with you or your people, and you know as well as I do that some of our "people" are the same folks. I dont actually have that much of a bone to pick here.

[Reality_Check]

Some of us still believe in an old-style journalism where egos are put in check . . . Hilarious one, Dexter. That's rich, truly.

Back here on Earth, some of us still recall an old-style journalism where we worked alongside Joe Falls, Pete Waldmeir, Charlie Manos, June Brown, Susan Stark, Marji Kunz, Cathy Horyn, Dave Ashenfelter, Gary Schuster, Roger Martin, Angelo Henderson, Norm Sinclair, Melvin Claxton, Fred Girard, John Broder, Chauncey Bailey and countless others with varying degrees of talent whose egos most definitely were not put in check.

And here's the kicker, Ferryman: The paper and its readers generally were better off for it.

So believe and say whatever you want about LeDuff, but don't go sugarcoating big league journalism that was balls-out and ego-propelled.

[thefishwrap]

I think everyone repeating the theme "more than one journalist can write about a person" just doesn't get it.

No one is saying coonman was off limits to Leduff because MT already had a story on him. But when another media outlet in your town writes an in-depth profile on a "local character" and then a bigger outlet sends out their "local color" guy to do an in-depth story on the same character, it seems the DECENT THING TO DO would be acknowledge the first one or make the second one different enough to justify its ink. In this case, the story (and the videos) are shockingly similar and the first story wasn't acknowledged.

Please show me an example of another news organization writing about the same feature subject giving the first media outlet credit for writing about it first. It doesn't happen. Ever.

Big, breaking news -- yeah, it happens sometimes. Like the Kwame stuff, in the Detroit News, they would often say, "in text messages printed by the Detroit Free Press," but feature stories, it doesn't happen.

[Blarf]

Charlie LeDuff still has a job?

I find it hard to believe that people actually ENJOY his writing and take it seriously.

[mauser]

Charlie needs to pop up and splain some stuff - maybe there is a side to this that we dont know. You out there somewhere CLD ?

I still think hes too busy to read our tripe here.